Official Languages Committee on March 21st, 2018

[Francis Sonier]

That is indeed the case, because you have to maintain the newspaper you publish, daily or weekly, and in addition, you have to feed the platform. So we now have two media to feed, but with fewer resources and less revenue. The challenge is twofold, because people don't wait till the next day.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

You are experiencing the same thing as the people in Manitoba.

[Francis Sonier]

That's right.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Mr. Côté, what is your relationship like with Radio-Canada in Quebec, if you have one?

[François Côté]

We talk to each other, but our dealings are not extensive.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Okay.

[François Côté]

In some locations, Radio-Canada has allowed us to place an antenna on one of their towers, but we have to pay rent.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

No doubt. How many community media have closed their doors over the past years?

[François Côté]

One of our radio stations closed in November in Rivière-la-Paix.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you, Mr. Vandal.

Mr. François Choquette now has the floor.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank all of you for being here.

Thank you very much for being here today.

I'll begin with the acting commissioner's June 2017 report. It's been less than a year, mind you. There were two very clear recommendations in it, recommendations 2 and 3. I think they are really important. They were addressed, among others, to Public Services and Procurement Canada. The problem may lie there. When the ministerminister came to meet with us, she had no idea of the situation you are in. From what I understand, that was your impression as well.

One of those recommendations was that an analysis be done of the impact of advertising on minority official language community media. The department carried out that bogus study you referred to. Why did the department not listen to you, and why does it intend to release it? It does not reflect in any way the real effects of the displacement of advertising.

[Richard Tardif]

I don't have any answer to that question, honourable member Monsieur Choquette.

It was a big surprise to us last October when we arrived for our committee consultative meeting. One of the things we were not pleased with was that we were not consulted, nor were we made aware that this was a study to be presented to us.

I want to point out that we were shocked that they did not contact the communities of our respective associations. For example, for Westmount in Quebec, it's well known as 80% plus anglophone, give or take, over the years, but they reduced that to 40% to make their data work. We don't have 40%. We have more. We were not represented. This situation occurred in New Brunswick as well.

I have no way to answer that, other than to explain what they did.

[François Côté]

The only reason we can think of is that the department wanted to justify its actions. That is what the study reflects.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

According to the figures, in 10 years, you lost about $20 million in advertising. When you ask for $2 million, is it simply to get back the money that you lost? It isn't an additional investment that would add to what you had before. That seems totally logical to me.

As some have mentioned, not everyone uses Facebook. You mentioned that in addition, Facebook does not pay tax, and that there is no tax on advertising, but especially that it is the government's responsibility to further the vitality of the communities. That seems self-evident.

When the Minister of Canadian Heritage states that her department will not support the digital transition of business models that are no longer viable, what do you have to say to her?

[Francis Sonier]

In several minority communities—I'm speaking about the APF newspapers here—the newspaper is the only media people can count on. Sometimes the populations are dispersed over certain areas, and they need support in one way or another. That is why certain programs already exist.

If people believe that those newspapers will have a critical mass and quickly become independent following the digital shift, they are mistaken. That is inaccurate. It will not happen. Even those who have good platforms, a large number of visitors and a large readership have trouble. It is an illusion to think that minority newspapers will manage to generate big revenues.

We are open to the idea, and people are heading toward digital platforms, but our population is still very loyal to the traditional paper support. That is the reality. I think that the reference to “business models” was a reference to the big media groups.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

It does not apply to minority official language communities.

[Francis Sonier]

No, because the reality is different. We have to be aware of that, because there is a real risk.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Ms. Lapointe, you have the floor.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you very much for being here. I appreciate it.

We are talking about loyalty to paper, and we have heard other witnesses before you. It is really from that angle that we want to help minority official language communities. Concretely, what recommendations should we make to help the media maintain their vitality?

I believe I understood that the situation is different for radio, because you seem to attract a greater number of listeners through the Internet. However, the media and the written press are losing some of their clientele. The transition to digital will happen, as you said, but it seems that that is the issue.

You said that you supported the digital shift—and that is where we are headed—but there is an emergency, since you are here. The first recommendation is about advertising, and we heard it clearly.

[Francis Sonier]

The situation is so urgent that I have been in Ottawa for three days. My colleagues are the directors of organizations, and I am a newspaper director. We have had to make decisions this year. Everyone is expecting feedback from meetings I have been to over the past three days, but I have absolutely nothing to report to them. What can I say to my shareholders? What should I say to the employees whose pension fund I had to cut in January? What should I say to them?

Your decisions and your responsibilities hold a promise of hope. I respect your mandate, but I am asking you to go far beyond your mandate. Your study is a good thing, but when you leave the room today, call or send an email to make an appointment with the ministers. It is urgent.

What is happening is really dangerous. If the newspapers, whatever newspapers they may be, are having trouble, we won't make it, I tell you. We have been fighting for 10 years. We have done everything possible, everything imaginable; we went to see all of the departments but we obtained no results. We filed a complaint in 2015, and almost three years later, we still have no results. There are departments that refuse to commit. There are no results.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

You have to target most departments directly; you listed them earlier.

[Francis Sonier]

Indeed.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Some of them were less attentive.

[Francis Sonier]

Yes, some of them were less inclined to listen.

[François Côté]

I would simply like to add—and I am addressing you, Mr. Samson, because the situation of francophone radio in Nova Scotia is critical—that when we say that some of them will not make it to the end of the year, some of them are in Nova Scotia. We have to act immediately, because we can't wait any longer. Radio Rivière-la-Paix has closed its doors, and other stations are going to close in the west, just as they have in the east. It is unrealistic to hope that we will finish the year with 27 members.