Official Languages Committee on Oct. 10th, 2024

[Chantal Ouellette]

That number concerns early childhood, not school from kindergarten to grade 12.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

If you look at the school system, are the figures the same?

[Chantal Ouellette]

Just a moment; I have to check those numbers.

Mr. Levesque, can you lay your hands on those numbers faster than I can?

With regard to the school system, 49,010 children are eligible to attend French-language schools in New Brunswick. In September…. At the time of Census 2021, we had 29,262 students. So 19,748 students don't attend school in the francophone educational system as they would be entitled to do.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Why do you think they don't? Is it because the schools are too far away?

[Chantal Ouellette]

Yes, these school proximity and transportation numbers, which Statistics Canada has provided us, clearly show that there is zero proximity in rural areas, particularly in regions where English dominates and parents ultimately choose to send their children to English-language schools.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Do you think that parents prefer to send their children to an anglophone school because it's very hard to find work in French?

[Chantal Ouellette]

We know that immigrants from francophone countries, such as France and Belgium, choose to put their children in the anglophone education system because they believe their children won't become bilingual if they put them in the francophone system, whereas bilingualism is the reason why they've come to New Brunswick, the only bilingual province.

And yet you can catch English like you can catch a cold in New Brunswick. There isn't necessarily any fear in that regard, but they don't know that and they make that choice.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

That's true, especially if they're in a region where not much French is spoken, in a region where English dominates, as you said.

[Chantal Ouellette]

That's correct.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

You also said that the official languages in education support programs were inadequate.

The province's programs also appear to be inadequate. Do you think you can ultimately combat assimilation? That's a tough question.

[Chantal Ouellette]

Unfortunately, no.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

That's a realistic answer. That's good.

[Chantal Ouellette]

Exactly. With the resources we have and the budgetary restrictions we face, we're hopeful, but—

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Are the community school centres in Prince Edward Island funded by the provincial governments as well, or are they funded by the federal government?

[Brad Samson]

Construction costs are shared, but operating costs fall to the province.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I believe my time is up.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

You had five seconds left. Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu.

Thanks to the witnesses.

The last person to ask questions in this six-minute round is from the New Democratic Party, and that's Ms. Ashton, a long-standing francophile, who now has the floor.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

I've been one since I was five years old; that's long-standing indeed.

Thanks to the witnesses for being here today.

My first questions concern early childhood and are for Mrs. Ouellette.

Mrs. Ouellette, thank you for describing the situation in your province for us. You discussed the infrastructure challenge—all of you have done so—and you said there weren't enough day care spaces. We clearly understand that this is a challenge that the federal government needs to address.

I also want to raise the labour shortage issue. I've previously said on numerous occasions that I myself have been on a waiting list for spaces for my two children, my twins, at a francophone day care centre near our home in Manitoba. I've never managed to get them into that day care centre because, even though they had space—and I say space, not spaces—there weren't enough people to work in the centre in French.

I think we have to acknowledge that there's a labour shortage. Mrs. Ouellette, is there an early childhood labour shortage in New Brunswick's francophone day care centres?

[Chantal Ouellette]

Yes, that's our situation in New Brunswick. It's the situation in both the anglophone and francophone sectors, but it's definitely more acute in the francophone sector.

I know that certain school districts have chosen to recruit directly overseas in an effort to find staff who can come and work in our early childhood centres. Then those people have to be trained so they can be certified and get a pay increase.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Do you think the federal government has a key role to play in finding solutions to address this labour shortage in the French-language early childhood sector?

[Chantal Ouellette]

Yes, absolutely. The federal government has a role to play in funding and, as I mentioned, in skilled immigration, by which I mean taking in people who already have early childhood or education credentials.

That would help in the early childhood sector and would be much appreciated.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

All right. Thank you very much.

I'll put the same questions to you, Mr. Bernard and Mr. Samson.

What is the situation regarding the labour shortage in early childhood services in Prince Edward Island?

[Ghislain Bernard]

We definitely have a labour shortage. Somewhat as in New Brunswick, it extends to both anglophone and francophone day care centres, but it's more pronounced among the francophone ones. We often turn to immigration as well in an attempt to meet our needs.

We also have a labour shortage in the school sector. For the moment, we have no certified substitute teachers awaiting contracts. Our certified substitutes are retired teachers. Our other substitutes aren't certified.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Just a minute, Mr. Bernard.

I'll stop the clock. The interpretation is apparently not working.

Ms. Ashton, you have 2 minutes and 20 seconds left.

I'm being told that it's working again. Mr. Bernard, you may continue.

[Ghislain Bernard]

Our challenges are quite similar to New Brunswick's, which Mrs. Ouellette just discussed.