Evidence of meeting #120 for Official Languages in the 44th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was schools.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Former School Counsellor, As an Individual
It's important to know what the intention behind section 23 of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms was when Jean Chrétien introduced it way back when. Was it to recognize those who already existed and a few exceptions, or was it to leave the door wide open? Unfortunately, our francophone school boards took advantage and went much too….
Forgive me, I'm getting a little—
Liberal
The Chair Liberal René Arseneault
It's getting clearer. I think I understand what you're saying. When the school boards—so the provinces—grant anglophones who are not rights holders the right to send their children to French schools, any children born into the family going forward become rights holders. It gets passed on to subsequent generations.
Is that what you are saying?
Former School Counsellor, As an Individual
The school boards are to blame. They are the ones letting in the children, without taking into account the impact on little francophones.
Former School Counsellor, As an Individual
People are putting their careers above the survival of French.
Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Parents for French
Education ministries are the ones giving the school boards the authority.
It's fair to say that a school board in a remote area might use an interpretation that suits its needs and change the criteria. For example, if a parent asks the school board to let their child attend the school because the parent is fluent in French and plans to raise the child in French, the board could agree to the parent's request.
The situation changes depending on the province and school board.
It would be really important for the committee's study to examine the different interpretations out there.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal René Arseneault
The thing that's important for the committee to understand is that a rights holder is being given a fairly broad interpretation by school boards in order to bring up their student numbers. It's a vicious circle.
There is a bit of time left, so I'm going to be generous, Mr. Samson. We know you well.
Conservative
Joël Godin Conservative Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC
I just want to make a comment, Mr. Chair.
You ought to participate in the discussion more often. Your question was highly pertinent. Thank you.
Liberal
Darrell Samson Liberal Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS
I have something to say as far as shedding light on the definition of a rights holder goes. It's even broader than we heard.
First, the Supreme Court determined that school boards have the authority to grant the right, and the provinces work with them. They understand the principle.
It can work other ways, though. Consider this scenario: two anglophones in Nova Scotia who don't speak a word of French and the parents move to Quebec. The children attend school in French in Quebec for one term. When the family returns to Nova Scotia, the children are rights holders, and they automatically get to do their schooling in French.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal René Arseneault
We know about situations like that. They are covered under the law. Someone merely has to attend school in French, no matter how short that schooling is.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal René Arseneault
Exactly.
During your five-minute presentation, Mr. Dorion, you talked about the fact that anglophones who had not been granted any legal right were becoming rights holders, at which point, the generational domino effect begins.
Former School Counsellor, As an Individual
School boards go after anglophones. They take out full-page English-only ads in the Toronto Star encouraging parents to put their children in the French system. However, once that right has been granted, there is no oversight. They are given the password to get in. It's akin to giving someone a test but giving them the answers first.
There are exceptions. I have a lot of anglophone friends who are very committed. One in particular took her children to Quebec on vacation to expose them to a French environment. Nevertheless, it is a small minority. The others just want to be allowed in, and once that happens, their commitment fades.
Even schools tell parents not to worry, saying they will take care of it. Take care of it, my foot.
Liberal
Conservative
Joël Godin Conservative Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC
Mr. Dorion, I don't think it's a bad thing to have more rights holders, because they get access to French-language instruction. That's a plus for francophones.
That said, I understand that the environment is not ideal, but I do welcome a greater number of rights holders.
Former School Counsellor, As an Individual
It can be positive, but I can tell you about my daughters' friends. I have four daughters who are now adults. Many of the kids they went to school with can't understand French anymore. If parents don't put in the work at home, nothing happens.
Conservative
Joël Godin Conservative Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC
At least, it is like riding a bike. It comes back quickly. It's just practice.
Former School Counsellor, As an Individual
Yes, but we have to worry about francophones if we want to keep them. Otherwise, what's the point?
Liberal
The Chair Liberal René Arseneault
Esteemed witnesses, thank you for contributing to this discussion and answering the committee's questions. Official languages, especially as they relate to education, are compelling issues to Canadians, so this is a great study we are doing.
Thank you for your patience. This was your first time before the committee. Although it's not something we can really do, we would make you VIPs if we could.
Now, we'll now suspend briefly while we move in camera.