No, not at all.
Evidence of meeting #51 for Public Accounts in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was insurance.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #51 for Public Accounts in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was insurance.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:45 p.m.
Former Minister, President of the Treasury Board, As an Individual
No, not at all.
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Okay. That's all I'm looking for.
What about you, former minister McLellan?
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Okay. Did you have any prior knowledge that this forensic audit was under way in regard to David Smith, Mr. Brazeau, and these other people?
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
You're both nodding no. So let the record show the answer is no.
4:45 p.m.
Former Minister, President of the Treasury Board, As an Individual
If you want to give me a chance to respond, Mr. Fitzpatrick, I'd be prepared to do so. The answer is no, it came after the government had fallen.
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Okay. That's what I'm looking for, sir. I'm not looking for opinions. I only want a yes or no answer.
4:50 p.m.
Former Minister, President of the Treasury Board, As an Individual
Well, you or your colleagues are making a lot of inferences about something that none of us have ever seen.
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
No, I'm not. I'm asking straightforward questions. It's a yes or no question. That's all I'm asking you, sir. I don't want to get into a debate with you on these matters.
4:50 p.m.
Former Minister, President of the Treasury Board, As an Individual
It must be frustrating.
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Have you any knowledge of what instigated this report?
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Did either one of you at any time prior to December 5, 2005, have any knowledge that David Smith was perhaps involved in this colluded arrangement between Mr. Crupi and Mr. Brazeau?
4:50 p.m.
Former Minister, President of the Treasury Board, As an Individual
If I may, the way you phrased it, the answer to your question is no, absolutely not. I had no knowledge of what was discussed here relative to the RCMP.
I can't reference exactly when it was, but at one point I believe there was an article in one of the newspapers to the effect that David Smith, an MP, or a company he was involved with had some involvement in receiving contracts from Consulting and Audit Canada. I was aware of that.
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
You've had a look at the audit by this period of time, have you not?
4:50 p.m.
Former Minister, President of the Treasury Board, As an Individual
I am interested. I understand it was tabled without any reference to the Access to Information Act. I note that all the stuff I have is blocked out.
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
4:50 p.m.
Former Minister, President of the Treasury Board, As an Individual
But if the government's position is to table these reports without editing, I'd love to see them. I actually have a list of them. I'll send it over to Mr. Poilievre's office.
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
I'm curious. Was it your practice, Mr. Alcock, to make sure that audits like these would be clearly marked “highly private and confidential”? I would say that outside the people who did the audit and the government officials, nobody would ever find out about this kind of report. It's more good luck than good fortune that we stumbled across this report.
Was it your practice, when you were President of the Treasury Board, to tell auditors that your audits of very serious matters of wrongdoing inside our department must be marked “private and confidential”?
4:50 p.m.
Former Minister, President of the Treasury Board, As an Individual
Mr. Fitzpatrick, you're talking about an audit that I have no knowledge of. When I was President of the Treasury Board, I did not conduct or review all audits. Quite a large number of them take place in what is the largest and most complex organization in the country of Canada. The audit practices are governed by independent auditors who are licensed as independent auditors. They pay attention to their own professional credentials. The practices are totally determined by them
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Did either one of you have knowledge that Mr. Brazeau had actually been fired by the Deputy Minister of Public Works even before this audit was completed? Did you have any knowledge of that firing?
4:50 p.m.
Former Minister, President of the Treasury Board, As an Individual
You're suggesting an involvement in the public sector that I think is inappropriate for a minister, and the answer is no.