Public Accounts Committee on Oct. 30th, 2014

[Wayne Smith]

Yes. We analyzed the returns from the 2006 census to identify areas and groups that were at risk of being under-counted. We focused our efforts in those areas where we had that concern.

[Stephen Woodworth, Conservative, Kitchener Centre, ON]

Excellent.

I wanted to ask you about the issue of census subdivisions. We know from the Auditor General's report that there was information from some census subdivisions withheld from the national household survey. Were there also some census subdivision areas that did not produce data in 2006?

[Wayne Smith]

It was a much smaller number, but yes, there were some in 2006. In every census there are some census subdivisions for which we feel the quality is insufficient to publish the data.

[Stephen Woodworth, Conservative, Kitchener Centre, ON]

As I understand it, overall the difference in unavailable population data rose from 1% in 2006 to 3% in 2011, a difference of only 2% of overall population from which data was unavailable. Is that correct?

[Wayne Smith]

That's correct.

[Stephen Woodworth, Conservative, Kitchener Centre, ON]

You know, I've heard a couple of times some of you gentlemen say that there was a slight increase in the number of responses, but actually, weren't there 200,000 more responses to the 2011 household survey than there were to the 2006 national census?

[Wayne Smith]

That's true.

[Stephen Woodworth, Conservative, Kitchener Centre, ON]

All right. Thank you.

I'd like to focus a little bit, if I may, Mr. Ferguson, on the actual focus of the audit. I see that on page 19 the objective is stated:

To determine whether Statistics Canada ensures the quality of key socio-economic information it produces, and generates this information efficiently and in response to priority user needs.

I'm reading that right out of your book, so I know that was your focus.

In looking at that, did you find that Statistics Canada actually already had a quality assurance framework and guidelines in place to try to ensure the quality of its data?

[Michael Ferguson]

We identified that there was a quality framework in place that included six different aspects to it, yes.

[Stephen Woodworth, Conservative, Kitchener Centre, ON]

Good.

In particular—

[The Chair, NDP, David Christopherson]

I'm sorry, Mr. Woodworth. You're just out of time.

We'll move now to Monsieur Giguère.

[Alain Giguère, NDP, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I thank the witnesses for appearing before our committee.

I have an important question on vacant positions, mentioned in point 8.50.

Because of Statistics Canada's incapacity, if I may say, to answer that question, governments are unable to determine if a request to bring in foreign workers is justified or not. Currently, there are more than 100,000 foreign workers who occupy jobs that could be occupied by Canadians. The whole issue is rather concerning. In your reply to point 8.55, you seem to indicate that budgetary reasons are what prevent you from correcting the gap regarding vacant positions.

Would an increase in your budget allow you to resolve that problem, and thus allow us to settle the issue regarding foreign workers in a satisfactory way?

[Wayne Smith]

An agreement is already in place with Employment and Social Development Canada to begin surveys on that in the near future.

[Alain Giguère, NDP, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC]

In other words, there will be a budget increase to solve a problem that should never have existed, if at the outset you had had a sufficient budget.

[Wayne Smith]

I apologize, but I missed the last part of your question.

[Alain Giguère, NDP, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC]

If you had had adequate funding in the beginning, the problem regarding foreign workers would not have affected us so much, since we would have known exactly what jobs were truly vacant.

[Wayne Smith]

That is your conclusion. I cannot confirm or deny what you are saying. Since I have no responsibility at all for the Temporary Foreign Worker Program, I cannot take a position on that.

[Alain Giguère, NDP, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC]

Can we agree to say that over the next few years, we will know what local vacant positions may be filled by Canadians, and which ones may be filled by foreign workers?

[Wayne Smith]

According to what I understand, the survey we are developing at this time will allow us to determine specifically, by economic region and by occupation, what positions are available and what the related salaries are. As to the frequency of that exercise, I don't remember if it will be monthly or quarterly, but it will be regular.

[Alain Giguère, NDP, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC]

Very well.

Regarding the unemployment rate, we noted two troubling facts. First there was a major error concerning employment created, and also an error in the calculation of the unemployment rate which excluded aboriginal populations, first nations.

Can you give us some details on those incidents and tell us how you are going to correct those situations?

[Wayne Smith]

If I understand correctly, the incident you are mentioning concerns the inaccurate data we published last July and August. This was entirely Statistics Canada's fault. It was in no way linked to a budget cut. In fact, the budget for that program had not been reduced. This was entirely our fault. The program had not been sufficiently tested and was included in the production system.

As soon as we detected the error we removed that data and informed the public. We published corrected data and we launched an examination to determine what measures to take to avoid such errors in future. These measures are now in effect. As for other important economic data, we changed our procedures to ensure that in future we ask the right questions before publishing data.

I'm sorry, but I don't remember your second question.

[Alain Giguère, NDP, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC]

It concerned the calculation of the unemployment rate which did not take first nations into account.

[Wayne Smith]

We take that into account.

From the very inception of the Labour Force Survey in the 1940s, reserves were not included in that study, which generates figures on employment, mainly because of the cost. In light of the sample we have currently, we could not publish data on reserves. The population concerned is 300,000 to 400,000 people for all of Canada. Even if we included those people, this would not change our estimates in a significant way.

However, the number of reservations and their geographic isolation would mean that the costs would be major for Statistics Canada. It would also be very difficult to publish that data and keep it as up-to-date as the other data we publish at this time. In the past, we used to measure the employment rate in reserves through census data. We now do so with the National Household Survey every five years. This allows labour market analysts to quite precisely assess gaps in participation in the labour market between the reserves and the surrounding census divisions.

[The Chair, NDP, David Christopherson]

Thank you very much.

Time has long expired.

Thank you.

Now we'll move over to Mr. Carmichael.

You have the floor, sir.

[John Carmichael, Conservative, Don Valley West, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Welcome to our witnesses this afternoon. Thank you for your input.

Mr. Ferguson, the audit examined whether StatsCan ensures that its information is of good quality, is produced efficiently, and responds to user needs. All the way through the report, the findings are positive overall.

In your report, you said, “Statistics Canada assessed the coherence of the selected data products.”

I wonder if you could expand a bit on that for us.