Public Accounts Committee on Oct. 2nd, 2024

[Cassie Doyle]

The agreement is finished, but we are really dedicated to making sure we've done the due diligence and have all of the reporting and paperwork done. We're very close now to having the first round of disbursements go out the door.

[Valerie Bradford, Liberal, Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON]

Do you have any guesstimate as to when that might happen?

[Cassie Doyle]

I'd say in the next few weeks.

[Valerie Bradford, Liberal, Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON]

It would definitely be by the end of the year. Would that be safe to say?

[Cassie Doyle]

Yes, definitely it will be by the end of the year. I'd say the restart will definitely happen before the end of October.

[Valerie Bradford, Liberal, Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Williamson]

Thank you very much.

We are beginning our fourth and final round.

Mr. Brock, you have the floor for five minutes, please.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I'm going to follow up on a couple of loose threads from the questioning of my colleagues, starting with Madame Sinclair-Desgagné.

She asked you whether or not you're in a position to apologize for the mis-characterization of the whistle-blower who blew the lid open on this scandal. I believe your response was simply that it was “in the past” and that you're part of a new board.

Representing the board and governing under SDTC, you are not taking a position to apologize for the state of affairs at this particular corporation. Is that what I'm hearing?

[Cassie Doyle]

No, we were brought in to provide strong governance and executive oversight to SDTC. I wasn't in the organization at the time that Witness 1 was working there—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

I'm sorry to interrupt.

No one has accepted responsibility. No one has apologized for this boondoggle that the assistant deputy minister called, on a secret tape, a sponsorship-like scandal, the likes that this country has not seen since the demise of the Chrétien-Martin government. We're talking about almost a billion dollars of taxpayer funds that went out the door that should not have.

If you're not prepared to apologize.... I'll keep on record that you're not prepared to do that because you're part of a new board.

My colleague, Mr. Cooper, also asked you a question regarding recovery. I know you have a mandate with respect to recovery, but despite being four months into the job and despite clear evidence from the Ethics Commissioner about violations under the Conflict of Interest Act with a defined amount of money that was improperly disbursed to the former chair, Annette Verschuren—that is conclusive evidence—I guess what I'm hearing from you is that it's not a priority. It's not a priority for you. It's not a priority for the board. It's certainly not a priority for this government.

What are you saying to taxpayers?

[Francis Drouin, Liberal, Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

I respect my colleague, Mr. Brock, but he's putting words into the witness's mouth without even providing any evidence to this committee. The witness has answered to me that there are investigations currently going on.

I love to follow the evidence, but when we're opining, this is where I question the auditor's ability, on the other side, to actually get to the bottom of this and find the truth.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Williamson]

The witness can add. While you might find the questions—

[Francis Drouin, Liberal, Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON]

You can put that on Rebel News if you want.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Williamson]

Mr. Brock, I've stopped the clock.

That is not a point of order. You might be irritated with the style and the question, but it is Mr. Brock's time and the witness is able—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Why don't you stop interrupting, so I can ask a question? How's that, Mr. Drouin?

[Francis Drouin, Liberal, Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON]

That's not a question. That's opining. Follow the truth. Follow the evidence.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Williamson]

Gentlemen, the witness is here to answer questions.

Mr. Brock, you have the floor again, please.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I apologize, ma'am, for the interruptions from the Liberal bench. They don't like hearing tough questions.

I want you to address Canadians because there are hundreds of thousands of Canadians who are following the scandal and following my social media posts and my colleagues' social media posts about this scandal.

What are you saying to Canadians about your priority in terms of ensuring money is paid back? What is the plan?

[Cassie Doyle]

The plan is to implement the findings of the Auditor General's report of June 2024, and we are well advanced in that work. Every recommendation has been implemented now except one, and that is why we are now reviewing every single project on an individual basis, as per her recommendation. Where there is any—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Are you completely disregarding the findings of the Ethics Commissioner, who made a finding of two violations under the Conflict of Interest Act with a defined amount? Why is it not a priority for your board, working with the ministry, to recover those funds from Annette Verschuren? Why aren't you doing that?

[Cassie Doyle]

We are in the process right now.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

That doesn't say anything. “Process” is government speak for “Take our word for it; we are going to make this a priority when we get to it.” You've had four months to do something about it. This is a priority for Canadians. It's not a priority to continue the funding. The priority is to get back almost a billion dollars of taxpayer funds that's just not being recovered. There is no process to recover that. That's a real, significant problem.

You also mentioned that you complied with the disclosure requests from this committee. Who gave you direction from the ministry to supply all the information as requested?

[Cassie Doyle]

We received the direction from the law clerk directly to SDTC.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Did I hear directly from you that you complied with each and every request from the law clerk and these documents were unredacted?

[Cassie Doyle]

Yes, you heard that correctly.