Public Accounts Committee on Feb. 10th, 2022

[Dr. Harpreet S. Kochhar]

This is a general process where, internally, whenever the audits happen, we continue to follow up. We have the management response action plans. We continue to work toward what other improvements we can make, and how quickly we can make them. We have internal deadlines which we continue to follow, and as the work continues on, we are able to show the improvements on that. This is not a specific process for this audit. All internal audits, or all evaluations, follow the same process.

[Blake Desjarlais, NDP, Edmonton Griesbach, AB]

Dr. Kochhar, the stockpile asked for 2012. Thank you, Madam Chair.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Jean Yip]

We now move on to our second round

We have Mr. Cooper, for five minutes, please.

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'm going to direct my questions to Dr. Kochhar.

Dr. Kochhar, you have stated that the comprehensive management plan will be completed within one year of the end of the pandemic. We know that we will be living with COVID forever.

Can you explain exactly what you mean by the end of the pandemic?

[Dr. Harpreet S. Kochhar]

As I alluded to this earlier, our idea is to complete this within one year. The World Health Organization declares the start and end of a pandemic based on global epidemiology.

Through a very formal declaration—

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

Just to clarify, when the WHO declares the end of the pandemic, within one year of that timeline, the comprehensive management plan will be complete. Is that correct, yes or not?

[Dr. Harpreet S. Kochhar]

That is true. That is what we are striving for.

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

That could be one year, that could be two years, that could be 10 years. Is that right?

[Dr. Harpreet S. Kochhar]

It is dependent upon how far we are into the current pandemic. Once the pandemic gets to the point where the WHO declares the end, then we will certainly have one year—

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

So you have no idea when?

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London North Centre, ON]

Point of order, Madam Chair.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Jean Yip]

I would remind members that witnesses are here on the invitation of the committee to answer questions on the report. I think we should show them the same respect, and allow them to answer our questions as best they can without being interrupted.

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

I think I have equal time, but I will give Dr. Kochhar a little more time to respond to what I understand his answer to be, which is that he simply has no idea.

[Dr. Harpreet S. Kochhar]

Madam Chair, what I am—

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London North Centre, ON]

Point of order, Madam Chair.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Jean Yip]

Go ahead, Mr. Fragiskatos.

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London North Centre, ON]

I don't want to keep doing this. This is the second meeting we've had. Witnesses will give answers. Members of Parliament will either accept, or not accept those answers, but to just be disrespectful to witnesses is not going to get us anywhere.

The comment that was just made at the end of my colleague's statement said that Dr. Kochhar had no idea what he was talking about—

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

That's not what I said.

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London North Centre, ON]

—or had no idea, rather. Those were the words used. This is not respectful of witnesses. Let's just keep a level of decorum that's becoming of this committee and our job as MPs.

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

Madam Chair, in response to Mr. Fragiskatos' point of order, the report of the Auditor General is a damning one in terms of the systemic failures of PHAC. The commitment that was made in this report was that a comprehensive management plan would be completed within one year of the end of the pandemic. In light of the overriding—

[Brenda Shanahan, Liberal, Châteauguay—Lacolle, QC]

Point of order.

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

No, no, in light of these significant failures, Canadians deserve to have some idea of a timeline.

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London North Centre, ON]

Point of order, Madam Chair.

The member can have his point of view, that's fine, but to be disrespectful of witnesses and interrupt them is not. That's my point.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Jean Yip]

Thank you.

Let's resume in a professional manner, please.

Go ahead, Mr. Cooper.

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

Again, I'm going to ask Dr. Kochhar to answer the question that I posed to him before Mr. Fragiskatos interrupted me with his point of order.