Thank you both for being here.
I'm not going to make a speech. I could spend a lot of time agreeing with you. What I'm interested in actually is following up on Mr. Davies' line of questioning. He asked most of the questions I would have asked. And I have spent time in jails—never sentenced—working with offenders, working with COs, and working with a number of issues in jails.
Where is the problem? What you say is common sense. We understand programs help people. We understand we need the foundation for those programs to work. We know there is a cycle. We know prisons are a culture and people learn bad habits there, especially if they don't get early treatment and early better habits. They get worse when they come out, instead of getting better. We've switched the name and we call them correctional facilities, but it's like George Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-four—we are not correcting; we are imprisoning. And the amount of correcting that is going on is actually very small. We know this.
We know drugs get in, and I always laugh because we can't keep drugs out of jails, yet we think we can keep them from coming across our border from the United States. It's ludicrous. We have people who are addicted before they get in, and if they're not, they're addicted by the time they get out.
Where is the problem? I am making a speech now. We know that $1 spent on programming saves at least $4. And I think that's a very modest estimate because we have the whole judicial system. We have the whole property loss. My car was stolen by an addict who was feeding his friends. He was not on drugs when he stole my car. He was one of the four out of five who are an addict coming into jail, not one out of two who did the crime while addicted.
Everything you have said makes perfect, rational sense, but someone is not getting the point. And I think we can tell who's not getting the point from our lines of questioning. But where is the problem?