Public Safety Committee on July 5th, 2010

[Richard Fadden]

Mr. Chair, I do not think that I neglected my responsibilities. As I said, I regret that I gave details. There was no threat to national security, and no one was identified. It was really a lack of attention on my part. I started answering questions. I am not as experienced as you with that sort of thing. I simply did not pay enough attention, but I never breached national security. I did not say anything that would have put me at risk of violating information security legislation.

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

But during a speech you gave in October, you referred to NGOs and the media. The way I see it, you stepped outside the lines that were supposed to have already been approved.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, Don Davies]

Madame Mourani, you're over time. Could you please ask your question?

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

Yes.

On October 29, 2009, at the Canadian Association for Security and Intelligence Studies annual conference, you made similar remarks. You referred to NGOs and the media as being soft on terrorist groups. Lines had been established, and you went outside those lines. From what I was able to hear of the CBC interview, the situation was the same. So I find it very hard to believe that you did not pay enough attention when you were speaking.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, Don Davies]

Madame Mourani, you must ask your question. You're over time.

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

Okay, sorry.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, Don Davies]

Mr. Fadden—

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

Mr. Chair, I just want to know this: are you going to step down, Mr. Fadden? Because I no longer think you belong in your position.

[Richard Fadden]

I disagree. I have no reason to step down. I mentioned a detail that in no way violates the law. As I have repeatedly said, I regret what I did. No, I will not be stepping down.

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

If the Prime Minister does not ask you to step down—.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, Don Davies]

Madame Mourani, you are way over time.

Mr. MacKenzie and Mr. Calandra I understand are going to share the next five minutes.

[Dave MacKenzie, Conservative, Oxford, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Mr. Fadden, I think earlier you said the minister did not know you would be releasing this information on the two cabinet ministers from the two provinces. By releasing that information to the military institute, did you contravene section 19 of the act?

[Richard Fadden]

I don't think so, because the information we were talking about is very general in nature. Had I mentioned names, had I mentioned specific details, then I believe I would have put myself at risk of violating the act.

Quite honestly, Mr. Chairman, if you look at our website, if you look at our annual reports, if you look at a variety of things that both I and other officers of the service have done over the years, this is not quite as extraordinary as everybody is making it out to be. I understand that it was an unfortunate specificity on my part, but this is not quite as extraordinary as it's being made out to be.

[Dave MacKenzie, Conservative, Oxford, ON]

Just so I understand, for clarification, the difference is that it was a general statement, as opposed to naming, and for that reason--

[Richard Fadden]

Broadly speaking, yes, Mr. Chairman.

[Dave MacKenzie, Conservative, Oxford, ON]

--you would see that as section 19 not being applicable in that regard--

[Richard Fadden]

Yes, Mr. Chairman.

[Dave MacKenzie, Conservative, Oxford, ON]

--and subsection (3) not being applicable under--

[Richard Fadden]

You're quoting the act again, and I don't--

[Dave MacKenzie, Conservative, Oxford, ON]

--section 19. Subsection (3) says:

(3) The Director shall, as soon as practicable after a disclosure referred to in paragraph (2)(d) is made, submit a report to the Review Committee with respect to the disclosure.

[Richard Fadden]

In my view, it does not apply.

[Dave MacKenzie, Conservative, Oxford, ON]

Because we're not talking about specific individuals?

[Richard Fadden]

Yes.

[Dave MacKenzie, Conservative, Oxford, ON]

Mr. Calandra.

[Richard Fadden]

Put differently, it was not a disclosure.