Evidence of meeting #4 for Public Safety and National Security in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was needs.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4 p.m.
Bloc
Maria Mourani Bloc Ahuntsic, QC
So the Martineau Community Correctional Centre is an example of a CCC that treats, on the outside, individuals suffering from varying degrees of mental disorders who are under the responsibility of Correctional Service Canada.
4 p.m.
Associate Director, Montreal-Metropolitan District, Correctional Service Canada
The centre will treat cases that have mental health problems and need special accommodation service.
4 p.m.
Bloc
Maria Mourani Bloc Ahuntsic, QC
Individuals who cannot be at home because there might be much too great a risk involved. That's correct?
4 p.m.
Associate Director, Montreal-Metropolitan District, Correctional Service Canada
Yes, or who have high needs as a result of which they require that type of structure.
4 p.m.
Bloc
Maria Mourani Bloc Ahuntsic, QC
At Martineau CCC, which is the only place in Quebec that handles mental health cases, do they still receive all criminal profiles, sex offenders, pedophiles, as well as mental health problems?
4 p.m.
Associate Director, Montreal-Metropolitan District, Correctional Service Canada
Yes, the criteria are associated with the mental health issues and do not exclude criminal behaviour.
4 p.m.
Bloc
Maria Mourani Bloc Ahuntsic, QC
This is quite an unusual case since the community correctional centre is located two or three minutes by foot from a school and a large child care centre. I admit this is a major concern in the constituency, although I know perfectly well that Martineau CCC is very effective and that it is a very good organization. I have absolutely nothing to say about that. It is in my riding and that is why I know it well. I've met the director twice. He knows me very well too. So we have a very good relationship. I have absolutely nothing to say about that.
However, after two ministers of Public Safety—we now have a third one—two questions and three years, do you think we can accept the idea of having pedophiles at Martineau CCC like Mr. Bégin, who was in our area? These individuals, who have mental health problems, who come from the Regional Mental Health Centre—these are major cases in some instances—are not choir boys. I'm speaking as a citizen. Do you think it's acceptable for them to be at Martineau CCC next door to our children, to the school and to the child care centre? It's a new child care centre that has just opened: It has nearly 50 children. What do you think about that?
4 p.m.
Deputy Commissioner, Quebec Region, Correctional Service Canada
I would say that all community resources—whether we're talking about CCCs or community residential centres—take in offenders for whom we've put a risk management mechanism in place. Martineau CCC does not have a larger concentration of pedophile cases; it has a concentration of cases with mental health problems. For Martineau CCC, of course, we've put in place an extremely tight monitoring mechanism for those offenders.
You visited the CCC yourselves and saw that they can't be released alone. They have to be accompanied by a CCC caseworker. And that will last as long as necessary in order to correctly assess the person's ability to—
4 p.m.
Deputy Commissioner, Quebec Region, Correctional Service Canada
To be released alone, but not only that. We also want to ensure the safety of people in the community.
So we go by stages. It's long, and it's a matter of supervision, but it's the best way to do it. What we believe is that—
4 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Garry Breitkreuz
You're almost half a minute over already.
Be very quick, okay?
4 p.m.
Bloc
Maria Mourani Bloc Ahuntsic, QC
All right.
You understand that people who live nearby send their children to those child care centres or to the École secondaire Marie-Anne nearby, attended by 14 and 15-year-old girls. As you can understand, the public does not have all this criminological analysis that can be conducted. So it's a big concern for them to have individuals in their area who not only have mental health problems—which would be manageable—but also have serious sexual deviancies. Consider the fine example of Mr. Bégin. These are not pedophiles that we can control; these are guys who have committed very serious acts who wind up there and at the Regional Mental Health Centre.
4:05 p.m.
Conservative
4:05 p.m.
Deputy Commissioner, Quebec Region, Correctional Service Canada
We understand the community's concerns and that is why Correctional Service Canada has put in place all kinds of mechanisms for consulting the community and for integrating them as well, particularly through the citizen advisory committees. The criminal problem is difficult for citizens to understand, and we understand that. So it's part of our mandate to go and explain how this is done and how we supervise them.
In practice, Mrs. Mourani, I would say it is much more comforting to know that they are supervised 24 hours a day, that we can monitor them if necessary and that we can bring them back to the institution rather than release them without supervision. It's a also a clinical service in that they are not left to their own devices and that they are really monitored regularly, not just with regard to the risk they present, but also with regard to their mental health status. If we stabilize their mental health status, we really help them reduce all the risk.
4:05 p.m.
Conservative
4:05 p.m.
NDP
Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC
Thank you. Merci beaucoup.
It's nice to see you again, Madame Vallée. I will speak in English, if that's okay, but feel free to answer in English or French, as you're comfortable.
As you know, we're studying addictions and mental health in the corrections system, so I'm going to try to zero in on that.
On page 10 of your remarks you have some statistics about people who complete substance abuse programs in the institutions. You have a time period, from 2009 to 2010--it's close to our parliamentary fiscal year--during which 420 offenders began a substance abuse program and 326 completed the program. You say that this is a 78% success rate. That is upon completion, I take it.
4:05 p.m.
A voice
It is completion.
4:05 p.m.
NDP
Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC
I'm just wondering if you keep statistics on long-term sobriety or cleanliness so that we can track a year later, three years later, or five years later how well the addictions therapy is working.
4:05 p.m.
Christine Perreault Regional Coordinator, Institutional Mental Health, Quebec Region, Correctional Service Canada
We don't have those numbers with us, but in fact, yes, we do keep statistics on long-term success--five years, ten years.
Are you talking about relapse, and whether they go back to substance abuse?
4:05 p.m.
Regional Coordinator, Institutional Mental Health, Quebec Region, Correctional Service Canada
Yes, we have some statistics. Part of our population does come back inside, behind bars, so we know about them. But most of them do not come back, and we don't have statistics on them. But in fact, yes, we can find numbers for you.
4:05 p.m.
NDP
Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC
Many offenders will be released into the community under conditions. I take it you would certainly have statistics on a large number of people who have left the institution and remain under conditions.