Evidence of meeting #25 for Public Safety and National Security in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was monitoring.
A recording is available from Parliament.
5 p.m.
Liberal
Francis Scarpaleggia Liberal Lac-Saint-Louis, QC
So how come you don't reach 17,000? How come you reach only 15,000 a year?
5 p.m.
Director General, Post-Border Programs, Canada Border Services Agency
Well, there are many obstacles to removal. Countries do have to cooperate with us to provide travel documents.
5 p.m.
Liberal
Francis Scarpaleggia Liberal Lac-Saint-Louis, QC
Yes, okay. So these people are not necessarily underground.
5 p.m.
Director, Case Management Division, Operations Branch, Canada Border Services Agency
No.
5 p.m.
Liberal
Francis Scarpaleggia Liberal Lac-Saint-Louis, QC
So the 44,000 are not necessarily underground. You know where they are.
5 p.m.
Director General, Post-Border Programs, Canada Border Services Agency
No, for those, we have warrants for arrest, because we don't know where they are.
5 p.m.
Liberal
Francis Scarpaleggia Liberal Lac-Saint-Louis, QC
I see.
We have this new category of asylum seeker called designated foreign arrival...?
5:05 p.m.
Director General, Post-Border Programs, Canada Border Services Agency
Designated countries of origin.
5:05 p.m.
Liberal
Francis Scarpaleggia Liberal Lac-Saint-Louis, QC
No. We're talking about Bill C-4. It hasn't passed yet, but we're talking about Bill C-4. They will be designated foreign arrivals and the government will have the right to keep them in detention for a very long time, really, if they come more than two together, or whatever it is....
5:05 p.m.
Director General, Post-Border Programs, Canada Border Services Agency
Yes. The current bill that was tabled today gives the Minister of Public Safety the right to designate “an irregular arrival” under two conditions. When the arrival—
5:05 p.m.
Liberal
Francis Scarpaleggia Liberal Lac-Saint-Louis, QC
Excuse me. I don't mean to interrupt, but I have limited time.
Bill C-4, which is the bill that we've debated already at second reading, was a response to the arrival of the Sun Sea and so on.
5:05 p.m.
Liberal
Francis Scarpaleggia Liberal Lac-Saint-Louis, QC
If someone is coming as part of group, a smuggled group, immediately they go into detention.
5:05 p.m.
Director General, Post-Border Programs, Canada Border Services Agency
No.
No, what I'm trying to say is that there are two criteria that trigger mandatory detention under Bill C-4: the arrival of numbers that overwhelm CBSA's capacity to conduct the necessary examinations to determine identity or to determine admissibility, or the arrival being associated with the suspicion that there's a link to smuggling, organized crime, or terrorism.
If either of those conditions are present, then the Minister of Public Safety may designate—
5:05 p.m.
Director General, Post-Border Programs, Canada Border Services Agency
—and then they are subject to mandatory detention for a period of 12 months after a negative determination by the IRB.
5:05 p.m.
Director General, Post-Border Programs, Canada Border Services Agency
Or if they're determined by the IRB to be refugees, they'll be released from detention.
5:05 p.m.
Liberal
Francis Scarpaleggia Liberal Lac-Saint-Louis, QC
Okay. In Australia, I think the time they would spend in detention is even longer. Maybe you're not aware, but it's not important....
What I'm getting at is, would it not be more humane and effective—and this has come up—rather than keeping families and young children in detention for up to a year or more.... Would it not be more humane to equip them with electronic monitoring devices?
5:05 p.m.
Director General, Post-Border Programs, Canada Border Services Agency
Well, let me say that the general practice for detention is that, on average, the individuals are in detention for about 17 days.
5:05 p.m.
Liberal
Francis Scarpaleggia Liberal Lac-Saint-Louis, QC
No, but now, though, they may be in detention for up to a year.
5:05 p.m.
Director General, Post-Border Programs, Canada Border Services Agency
Under Bill C-4, for a very specific group of individuals who arrive, could be in detention for up to a year or until their refugee claim is determined by the IRB, whichever is sooner. Under the bill that has been released today, the expectation is that a refugee determination will be made very quickly, within a matter of I think 40 days for designated country of origins. So the new system will work to ensure that people are not in detention unnecessarily.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Kevin Sorenson
Thank you very much, Mr. Hill.
I am sorry, Mr. Scarpaleggia, but I've already given you an extra minute.
We'll now go back to Mr. Chicoine.