Public Safety Committee on April 23rd, 2015

[Kathy Thompson]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Whether under the current authorization to transport regime or the one proposed in Bill C-42, it would be possible to obtain an authorization to travel that length of trip, either now separately or as part of your licence requirements. There is a requirement in legislation that you have to take the most direct route, and there are transportation requirements and storage requirements that apply, and the minister alluded to them earlier in terms of carrying the firearm.

It must be unloaded; it must be in an opaque, locked container; it must have a trigger lock on it. If you're going to leave the firearm unattended, as you suggest might be possible, then it has to be in the trunk, and if it's a kind of vehicle that doesn't have a trunk, like a pickup truck for example, it can't be visible. It must not be visible to anyone who's walking by the vehicle. So what you suggest is possible, but there are transportation and storage requirements that apply, and there is that requirement to take the most direct route, so I would suggest that, if you are stopping somewhere that is not part of what's been authorized, you could be in some difficulty.

[The Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Thank you very much, Mr. Casey. Your time is up.

Mr. Rousseau.

You have five minutes.

[Jean Rousseau, NDP, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Thank you very much.

My first question is for Mr. Murdock.

Let's talk about the sharing of information. If there is a situation where police forces have to intervene, what will facilitate information-sharing? They need to know what type of firearm is involved or who might have firearms in their possession.

We know that information-sharing in such situations is extremely important. It has to be quick and fairly precise. What is in the bill that could facilitate exchanging information in emergencies? We even went through that during the October 22 tragedy. Indeed, the sharing of information among the various police forces was quite difficult. What does this bill contain that could facilitate information-sharing in a situation where several police services might intervene when there is an incident?

[Lyndon Murdock, Director, Firearms and Operational Policing Policy, Department of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for your question.

[Roxanne James, Conservative, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Sorry to interrupt, but I have a point of order.

I'm not sure how this question relates to the bill that's before us. When the minister talked about the sharing of information, it was with regards to border security and getting a handle on illegal guns coming into the country. I'm not sure whether you're asking questions about that or whether you're just asking a general question about what occurs today. So I just didn't—

[The Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

I'll just ask Mr. Rousseau. Point made.

We'll just ask for some clarification on your perspective, sir.

[Jean Rousseau, NDP, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

For instance, in my riding, there are border crossings. The RCMP, the Sûreté du Québec and the Canada Border Services Agency may intervene if there is an incident close to the border. How would they go about exchanging information if they had to intervene and a belligerent person had a firearm in his possession? How do we know if that man owns a gun permit?

[The Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

That's a valid question. Please feel free to respond, Mr. Murdock.

[Lyndon Murdock]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for the question.

I would speak to two points with respect to your question. First, as part of the requirements for individuals having a firearms licence, they are subject, as the minister mentioned earlier in his comments, to continuous eligibility screening. So any police-reported information that is included in the Canadian Police Information Centre, otherwise known as CPIC, is brought to the attention of the chief firearms officer. With respect to day-to-day interventions, any police-reported behaviour is automatically brought to the chief firearms officer's attention for any appropriate action as the chief firearms officer deems necessary.

With respect to the information-sharing provision within Bill C-42, right now at the border when restricted, prohibited firearms are being imported by a business, it has nothing to do with individuals. When these types of firearms are being imported by a business, information is provided to the customs agent to ensure that the business is properly licensed and that the customs package invoice, that sort of basic information regarding the number of firearms, is provided to CBSA. That information is not provided to the RCMP. The provision in C-42 will essentially ensure that information that is provided to CBSA is provided to the RCMP so they can ensure that those firearms that do need to be registered can in fact be done so.

[Jean Rousseau, NDP, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Thank you.

There are seven border crossings in my area. Three or four of them are much busier during hunting season. Some people go to the Vermont mountains, others go the mountains on the Quebec side, and others head to our area, to Quebec. However, it seems that it is easier to cross from one side rather than the other.

How can Bill C-42 assure citizens that illegal firearms will not cross borders when border posts are busier, especially during hunting season?

[Kathy Thompson]

I am to going to go back to a point Mr. Murdock made earlier. The information that must be shared with the RCMP must be shared before firearms are imported.

[Jean Rousseau, NDP, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

I am talking about a situation where hunters, citizens, cross borders in one direction or the other. We are talking about the really busy times. We are not talking about imports.

[Kathy Thompson]

I apologize; you are correct. This situation is completely different. We were talking about imports by business earlier.

During peak periods the transport advantages will be related to the permits. These will not be two different documents, and it will all be very clear and visible. The permit, the transportation permit and what people have the right to do will all be indicated on a single document. I think it will be a little simpler.

[Jean Rousseau, NDP, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Thank you very much.

Now, Mr. Hayes, you have five minutes please, sir.

[Bryan Hayes, Conservative, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to step back to the background check information. I understand that when an individual applies for a licence, there's a significant background check. Is that check that's done at the end of that five years as significant as when the individual first applied for the licence?

Secondly, during the time that person owns that licence over the five-year period, what is done in terms of continuous screening? If an individual were to commit an offence during that five-year period, how would you pick up on that?

[Lyndon Murdock]

With respect to your question about the robust nature of the check at renewal at the end of the five-year period, the way that the licensing system works, as Ms. Thompson had indicated, is that there's a very significant focus and thorough check at initial licensing, when the applicant is originally applying for the licence.

Then we had talked briefly about the continuous eligibility screening. That is, as was alluded to earlier, on a daily basis any police-reported interaction will automatically be brought to the attention of the chief firearms officer for all firearms licensees.

Given that they are subject to ongoing screening on a daily basis, at the time of renewal, assuming there are no flags and the application is adequately completed, there's not as extensive an examination or check. It's generally renewed unless there are flags.

[Bryan Hayes, Conservative, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

During the course of that five-year period, what is the process for revoking a licence if during that five-year period the check determined that something was out of line with this individual? How quickly is a licence revoked, and what's the process for that happening?

[Lyndon Murdock]

If information is brought to the chief firearms officer, for example of violence or mental health issues associated with violence, then the chief firearms officer can revoke the firearms licence. At that time information is passed to law enforcement for appropriate action.

[Bryan Hayes, Conservative, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

So it's immediate then?

[Lyndon Murdock]

That's correct.

[Bryan Hayes, Conservative, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

I want to step back a little bit to the training. Who's qualified to deliver this classroom training? This is a multiple question. Where do they get the qualifications? To me it seems like there might be a business opportunity here for somebody to become qualified. How does one become qualified? How do you ensure that all the trainers do have the appropriate qualifications? What procedures are in place to vet that?

[Kathy Thompson]

Thank you.

Mr. Chairman, the curriculum is developed by the RCMP, working closely with provinces and territories and hunter educators. It's a very rigorous course. It's a standard curriculum across the country that can be tailored depending on regional requirements, and it's delivered in each region, province or territory, by instructors who are certified by the chief firearms officer in each of those provinces and territories. You must be a certified instructor in order to deliver the course.

[Bryan Hayes, Conservative, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

How many licences are issued each year?

[Kathy Thompson]

There are—