Even more stringently than that, those judges made those decisions without going into the units. In the visits we've been doing with the human rights committee, as we've gone into the maximum security units, every senator has recognized them as segregated conditions, without any of us saying it. It is from witnessing what they have access to, what they don't have access to, and what the meaningful intervention or meaningful contact is, which is negligible at best.
The reality is that people are living with two, three or sometimes four other people in common spaces that are smaller than the area of this—