Evidence of meeting #169 for Public Safety and National Security in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was rcmp.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Ralph Goodale Liberal Regina—Wascana, SK
Let me just double-check that point.
The plan, Mr. Motz, is that the reviewers on the CBSA side would deal with CBSA issues and that the reviewers on the RCMP side would deal with RCMP issues. It would be up to the chair and the vice-chair to determine the allocation of the personnel to hear any particular case, but I would think—
Conservative
Glen Motz Conservative Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB
They'd be two separate bodies inside of one commission.
Liberal
Ralph Goodale Liberal Regina—Wascana, SK
Essentially, yes. There would be an RCMP stream and a CBSA stream.
Conservative
Liberal
Ralph Goodale Liberal Regina—Wascana, SK
Exactly, because the issues are similar, but they're not identical.
Conservative
Glen Motz Conservative Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB
Yes.
Would there be an investigative ability inside that commission if the complainant isn't satisfied with the investigation with regard to the complaint?
Liberal
Ralph Goodale Liberal Regina—Wascana, SK
The investigative function would be the same for the CBSA work as it would be for the RCMP work. They have the capacity to make inquiries, to receive information, and to pursue any complaint that's presented to them to make sure that they have the facts in front of them—
Conservative
Conservative
Glen Motz Conservative Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB
It's separate from the CBSA. The CBSA has done the investigation. This commission could do another one on top of this, a separate one.
Liberal
Ralph Goodale Liberal Regina—Wascana, SK
If they're not satisfied with what they've been presented, yes.
Conservative
Glen Motz Conservative Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB
Then the commission itself has the ability to do it, or would it farm that out to another investigative body?
Liberal
Liberal
Ralph Goodale Liberal Regina—Wascana, SK
The chair and vice-chair of the commission would determine what resources, either internal or external, they require. They'll have a budget. Obviously, they want to get to the bottom of whatever a complaint is. They want to be able to satisfy either the employee who's complaining or the member of the public who's complaining, that the complaint has been treated fairly and competently and that the truth has been found.
Liberal
Liberal
David Graham Liberal Laurentides—Labelle, QC
Thank you.
In the event of a conflict of authority between the PCRC and the NSIRA, or even NSICOP, who prevails?
Liberal
Ralph Goodale Liberal Regina—Wascana, SK
It would be up to the agencies to sort out their respective jurisdictions. I suspect it will be pretty clear in most cases as to whether it's a national security issue or not.
The agencies in the past have had jurisdictional questions where they've had to work on things together. They've been able to resolve disputes in a way that is satisfactory, so I don't anticipate there's going to be a jurisdictional fight here.
Liberal
David Graham Liberal Laurentides—Labelle, QC
When the RCMP is operating in a contract position, for example, as provincial police, or here on the Hill in PPS, is the PCRC's power and oversight the same as an RCMP native operation?
Liberal
Liberal
Ralph Goodale Liberal Regina—Wascana, SK
—the first line of complaint would be the provincial review agency. There is one in every province.
Liberal
David Graham Liberal Laurentides—Labelle, QC
What about for the PPS side? The RCMP is contracted to provide a service, so—
Liberal
Ralph Goodale Liberal Regina—Wascana, SK
They're contracted to provide an officer. You'll have to consult the Speaker on that one, because that's the jurisdiction of the two Speakers.
Liberal
David Graham Liberal Laurentides—Labelle, QC
That's fair.
In overseas operations, when the RCMP is doing training missions, for example, or the CBSA is doing pre-clearing, which is another one of the bills that you brought forward, is the PCRC empowered to investigate overseas in the same way as they are domestically?
Liberal
Ralph Goodale Liberal Regina—Wascana, SK
The powers of the review body in relation to the RCMP will not change. Whatever exists now, continues. CBSA is then added to it.
