Public Safety Committee on Feb. 13th, 2018

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London North Centre, ON]

Okay, thank you very much for that reassurance.

Can you comment on where the proposed new offensive cyber capabilities that Bill C-59 offers would take us in comparison with our Five Eyes allies in this particular area?

[Shelly Bruce]

I am not an expert on all of our allies' authorities, but this generally brings us in line with the activities and the authorities that they have at their disposal, and positions us to be a coalition partner in various broader activities that go beyond a national scope.

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London North Centre, ON]

Thank you very much.

If I could, with the last question here, I'll ask anyone who wishes to to take it. I've been reading the 2017 public report on the terrorist threat to Canada, produced by Public Safety. In that report, there are a number of references to far-right extremism and what that means for Canada from a terrorist-threat perspective. The report says that a dedicated module on extreme right-wing groups is currently under development. It's being developed by the first responder terrorism awareness program team. The report says that while far-right activity, far-right extremism, has always been a concern, this is the first time—at least that's what the report implies—that a dedicated approach in the form of a module here has been created. Does this mean that the Department of Public Safety is particularly concerned, now more than ever, about the threat of far-right extremism in Canada?

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Unfortunately, Mr. Fragiskatos's time has expired, which is partly my fault, but I'm going to get you to respond, if you could, briefly so that we can get in as many questions as we can.

[Malcolm Brown]

Really briefly, I'm not sure I can say more than ever, but I will ask Gilles Michaud to respond to the specific question.

[D/Commr Gilles Michaud]

That specific module is really a law-enforcement push. We've seen the increase in activities, and we would say that an aspect of the threat that we have is that we had taken our eyes off the ball, I guess, for a number of years. Right now there's a push to really delve into it. With our police of jurisdiction, because that's mainly where those activities occur and where the responsibility lies, we're trying to get a better understanding as to the existence of that threat and the level.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Thank you, Mr. Fragiskatos.

Mr. Motz, go ahead for five minutes, please.

[Glen Motz, Conservative, Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you again to the group for being here.

Back on November 30, when many of you were here, I asked for a full costing for the implementation of this bill to been done. I don't see that it was submitted to the committee. If you have, that's great. If you have not, could you please do that for us? If it could be specific to compliance requirements and the extra costs for this bill, that would be awesome. Thank you.

I want to get into the—

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Hold on for a second, Mr. Motz. Are you asking for that to be an undertaking to the committee?

[Glen Motz, Conservative, Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB]

Yes, please.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Mr. Brown would say yea or nay.

[Malcolm Brown]

Yea.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Okay.

[Malcolm Brown]

Is “nay” an option?

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Malcolm Brown]

We'll endeavour to provide—

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

You could claim some vague cabinet confidentiality or something.

[Malcolm Brown]

There's some constraint, but I think we can provide more information. As I was prepping for this yesterday, I have to say that I noticed you had asked the question and that we hadn't responded, so we will respond to the specific question and some other.... It may come in, in sequence, but we'll get you some answers.

[Glen Motz, Conservative, Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB]

In light of the recent domestic terrorist attacks in the U.K., in Europe, and obviously here in Canada, which involved acquisition and the use of objects available to citizens—chemicals, vehicles, whatever—has the government reviewed the revisions in Bill C-59 to ensure that it permits appropriate emergency disruptive activities, specifically to CSIS, including without warrants where required? Are you satisfied with disruptive powers under this bill?

[Tricia Geddes]

Yes, I think we're very satisfied with this. We're glad to see that the government has reaffirmed its commitment to our warranted powers. I think it's another set of tools for the government to be able to respond, especially when threats are very fast-paced and emerge quite quickly from time to time. Obviously, we work very closely with the RCMP, but it is a very effective tool.

[Glen Motz, Conservative, Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB]

I'm going to ask this follow-up question to that and have both colleagues from the RCMP answer it as well.

Is there anything we can improve in that area, in this bill, that isn't there yet? Is there anything about which you, on second thought, thought, “You know what, it would be great if we had this in it”?

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

It's not likely they can actually answer that question.

[Glen Motz, Conservative, Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB]

I appreciate that, but you'd think there would be some freedom to get this right.

[Malcolm Brown]

If I might, I think we're happy to take advice from the committee on how the bill might be improved, and then the government will undertake its assessment of those suggestions.

[Glen Motz, Conservative, Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB]

Now I want to use the bureaucratic term again, but that's okay, I won't.