Public Safety Committee on April 5th, 2022

Evidence of meeting #17 for Public Safety and National Security in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was russia.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

Assessment of Canada’s Security Posture in Relation to Russia

MPs speaking

Also speaking

James Fergusson Deputy Director, Centre for Defence and Security Studies, University of Manitoba, As an Individual

Robert Huebert Associate Professor, Department of Political Science, University of Calgary, As an Individual

Veronica Kitchen Associate Professor, Department of Political Science, University of Waterloo, As an Individual

Ahmed Al-Rawi Assistant Professor, Simon Fraser University, As an Individual

Alexander Cooley Claire Tow Professor of Political Science, Barnard College, and Academy Adjunct Faculty, Chatham House, As an Individual

David Perry President, Canadian Global Affairs Institute, As an Individual

1:05 p.m.

Liberal

Sameer Zuberi Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC

Yes.

1:05 p.m.

Assistant Professor, Simon Fraser University, As an Individual

Dr. Ahmed Al-Rawi

Thank you very much.

Scientifically, I cannot prove these are bots, because bots are automated accounts. What I have seen is some kind of organic users, which means real users spreading propaganda. Most of the propaganda I have seen so far about the war on Ukraine is related to supporting the position of the Russian government and sending a lot of what we call confusing messages, again, to blur our idea of what is happening and to confuse people.

I think they are really on top of the game, because they are very fast in making this kind of disinformation and spreading it. Unfortunately, we are late.

1:05 p.m.

Liberal

Sameer Zuberi Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC

Can I ask you if the disinformation is in both English and French? Is it in any other languages aside from those two?

1:05 p.m.

Assistant Professor, Simon Fraser University, As an Individual

Dr. Ahmed Al-Rawi

With regard to the Russian diplomatic mission, it's mostly in English, but there is evidence that it's in French.

I've never looked at the Telegram channel WarOnFakes.com. They have a huge Telegram channel, which is now one of the most popular in Russia. Now the targets will also be—

1:10 p.m.

Liberal

Sameer Zuberi Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC

In the 45 seconds that are left, what are the impacts of disinformation? You mentioned diversity, inclusion, refugees, Muslims and others.

What are the real impacts on these communities for the disinformation campaigns you mentioned?

1:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Jim Carr

You actually have 10 seconds.

1:10 p.m.

Assistant Professor, Simon Fraser University, As an Individual

Dr. Ahmed Al-Rawi

It's trying to make people mistrust what is legitimate. That includes multiculturalism.

1:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Jim Carr

Thank you very much.

That completes the time that's available and then a bit more.

On the committee's behalf, I would like to thank the witnesses for a fascinating hour and change. There was a very complex and important set of questions and subjects.

With that, I would seek permission of the committee to adjourn the meeting.

1:10 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

1:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Jim Carr

I think I have it.

Witnesses, thank you so much for your time and your insights.

We'll see everybody on Thursday morning.

This meeting is now adjourned.