Evidence of meeting #74 for Public Safety and National Security in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was point.
A video is available from Parliament.
5 p.m.
Liberal
5 p.m.
Conservative
5 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Doug Shipley
Everybody, let's keep order here. Please, let's get through this as amicably and as best we can.
Ms. O'Connell, you have the floor. Are you finished?
5 p.m.
Liberal
Jennifer O'Connell Liberal Pickering—Uxbridge, ON
I just asked if the clerk could do the clarification that happens in most committees when there's a vote to challenge the chair's ruling. You clarify for all members that the challenge is to your ruling. If you support the chair's ruling, you would vote yes, and if you don't support the chair's ruling, you would vote no.
Thank you.
5 p.m.
Conservative
October 4th, 2023 / 5 p.m.
The Clerk of the Committee Mr. Simon Larouche
To answer Ms. O'Connell, we return to the matter at hand, the item on the agenda that the committee decided to deal with. It would mean that we would come back to clause-by-clause study of Bill C-20 at the end of the decision.
5 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Doug Shipley
What does a yes vote mean and what does a no vote mean? What are you voting yes to or no to? Can you just clarify that, not where we're going after that?
5 p.m.
The Clerk
Right now there's a motion to challenge the ruling of the chair, which was that the motion is in order.
If the motion is adopted, we return to the item that was decided by the committee to deal with, which is clause-by-clause study of Bill C-20.
If the motion is defeated, we return to the previous discussion.
5 p.m.
Bloc
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Bloc
Kristina Michaud Bloc Avignon—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC
I'm not sure I understand. What does it mean if we vote yes and what does it mean if we vote no? That's what we'd like to know.
5 p.m.
The Clerk
If the answer is no, we will resume debate on the motion introduced here for a return to—
5 p.m.
Liberal
Jennifer O'Connell Liberal Pickering—Uxbridge, ON
I'm sorry. If you vote no, it means you do not support—
5 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Doug Shipley
I have to recognize you first.
If someone votes yes, are they agreeing with Ms. O'Connell that...?
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A voice
No.
5 p.m.
Conservative
5 p.m.
Liberal
Jennifer O'Connell Liberal Pickering—Uxbridge, ON
On a point of order, this is why.... Do I have the floor?
5 p.m.
Liberal
Jennifer O'Connell Liberal Pickering—Uxbridge, ON
This is why I asked for this. It's because it's a reverse order of motion, and every committee always has this issue.
If you vote yes, it means you're supporting the chair's ruling. If you vote no, it means you are not supporting the chair's ruling. Then, as the clerk said, we'd go back to Bill C-20.
5 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC
I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.
The question is this: Shall the decision of the chair be sustained? If we're supporting the chair's decision, we would vote yes. If we are not sustaining the chair's decision, we would vote no.
5 p.m.
Conservative
5 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Doug Shipley
Did I hear a request for a recorded division?
We will have a recorded division.
(Ruling of the chair overturned: nays 7; yeas 3)
Go ahead, Mr. Genuis.
5 p.m.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
Thank you.
I move that the committee not proceed any further with clause-by-clause on Bill C-20.
The reason I'm moving that motion at this time is that I do not think we should proceed with clause-by-clause on this bill until the matter previously before the committee is disposed of. That matter is the desire of this committee on our side to allow victims and family members—
5 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Doug Shipley
Mr. Genuis, wait just one moment. There's a point of order.
Go ahead, Ms. O'Connell.