Public Safety Committee on Nov. 6th, 2025

[Rhonda Kirkland, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

There were three points of order in the first hour regarding the discussion of bills that weren't in that hour, so I just want to make a point of order for that on our side.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jean-Yves Duclos]

My answer is the same as I gave earlier.

Did you hear what I just said, Mr. Ramsay?

[Jacques Ramsay, Liberal, La Prairie—Atateken, QC]

I allow myself to go back to this because of the precedent ruling.

On Bill C-8, there are some critical structures such as hospitals and universities that are not in the law, for good reasons. It's because they are not under our jurisdiction.

I just would like for the minister to elaborate on what steps he's taking to inform our provincial partners, so they are up to speed on the protection of these critical structures.

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood—Rouge Park, ON]

Our cybersecurity centre has ongoing dialogue with the PTs. Certainly, when we met two weeks ago in Kananaskis, although it wasn't formally on the agenda, we did have a number of conversations around the impact of cyber-attacks on local infrastructure.

I do think it's an area we need to expand, because the disclosure will benefit.... If something happens in a provincial institution, it could happen federally and vice versa. I think that, operationally, the information will flow from us, but we'll need to get to a point where information also flows back.

There's a lot of suppression around this type of attack, because people either are embarrassed or don't want Canadians to lose confidence in the actual system itself, so there's a fair bit of apprehension in reporting.

I think we have to normalize that reporting is required for the betterment of everyone, because we are interdependent in many ways.

[Jacques Ramsay, Liberal, La Prairie—Atateken, QC]

Still on Bill C-8, the minister has been meeting with the Five Eyes partners. I'd like to know if he thinks that Bill C-8 matches what he's seen in other countries.

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood—Rouge Park, ON]

It very much does. Bill C-8 is an area.... Everybody is concerned about cyber-attacks. Many countries have been impacted by them.

The G7 meeting is coming up with the ministers of interior, and I believe this is on the agenda there. It is something that is critically important to the world. We do routinely share best practices. The G7 will be an opportunity for us to have that conversation.

I do want to just make a final pitch, because on the Five Eyes, one of the things that I want to underscore is that Canada is the only country that does not have a lawful access regime. It was pointed out to us, and we pointed it out to many of our colleagues.

I sincerely hope that we can get to a point where the elements of Bill C-2 that were left behind are incorporated into legislation.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jean-Yves Duclos]

That is appreciated. Thank you. I have to stop you.

To complete the third round, I now yield the floor to Mr. Brunelle‑Duceppe for two and a half minutes.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I’ll try and keep it brief, since I don’t have much time.

To the best of your knowledge, Minister, for how long has Canada been compiling data on departures from this country?

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood—Rouge Park, ON]

Could you repeat that question?

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

To the best of your knowledge, for how long has Canada been compiling data on departures from this country? Canada compiles data on entries, but when did it start compiling exit data?

I thought you would know, as Minister of Public Safety.

[Erin O'Gorman]

I don’t have dates, but as you know, we’re sharing information about the land border with the United States.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

How long have you been doing this?

[Erin O'Gorman]

I’m sorry, but I don’t have this information at present. I can provide you with the dates later.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Since 2019.

[Erin O'Gorman]

Their exits have been—

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

As I said, it’s been since 2019, when the plan was put into place. It’s been working since around 2020.

What about the airlines?

[Erin O'Gorman]

I don’t have dates, but it’s the same—

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Minister, it’s important to compile data on entries into and departures from the country. I can guarantee that it would be a good thing if the Minister of Public Safety knew if data on departures from this country were compiled. These are, after all, important data.

I’m not the minister of public safety, but from what I understand, we have only been compiling data on overland departures with the United States since 2020, but we aren’t doing it for ports or airlines. I’ve been told that airlines do compile the data, but they’re not obliged to pass them on to the government.

Don’t you think you could have used Bill C‑12 to improve this situation? It’s not acceptable for a G7 nation like Canada to be unable to compile data on departures from the country, while more and more people are entering and leaving the country. Would this not help you secure the borders?

[Gary Anandasangaree, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood—Rouge Park, ON]

I take your point, and what I can assure you of is that this is not the only new legislation that we plan to bring forward. In future iterations, we will assess the need to do this.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jean-Yves Duclos]

Thank you. That’s all the time we have.

That ends the third round of questions.

For information, here is the committee’s agenda: On November 18 and 20, we’ll hear from witnesses as part of our study of Bill C‑12. You have until noon on November 21 to submit amendments to Bill C‑12. The clerk has already sent us an email on this topic. On November 25, we’ll review Bill C‑12 once again. We’ll hear from witnesses for one hour and then start the section-by-section study of this bill at noon.

That said, thank you very much, Minister, and all the witnesses.

I wish you all a good day.