Science and Research Committee on Feb. 9th, 2023

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

On the Prairies we have organizations like Delta Waterfowl.

Dr. Moran, do you have any comments on that?

[Dr. Kathryn Moran]

Are you asking if Ocean Networks Canada is a conservation organization? Can you clarify the question?

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

Do you consider non-profit conservation organizations to be part of citizen science?

[Dr. Kathryn Moran]

I think those organizations do have citizen science programs.

At Ocean Networks Canada, we're a non-profit. We don't consider ourselves a conservation organization. We operate infrastructure for scientific purposes and we are basically agnostic on issues but of course keenly interested in the important issue of our time, which is climate change.

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

Okay.

Thank you.

I'll give the rest of my time to Mr. Lobb.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Corey Tochor]

Mr. Lobb.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

For both our guests here, it may seem like a peculiar question, but who actually owns the data that is collected?

Maybe Ms. Moran could start.

[Dr. Kathryn Moran]

That's a great question.

With each of the communities we work with, we have an agreement. In some cases the communities want to be the owners. We have an incredibly rich data system that follows strict principles, fair care OCAP principles, to ensure that, for example, if the indigenous community wants to own that data, we work with them to follow the OCAP principles to ensure that we respect and share those data in ways that are basically controlled by them.

Some organizations are happy that Ocean Networks Canada, as a society, owns the data, and we, then, follow our fair principles, which are international principles on data capture, archiving and accessibility.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Jason.

[Jason Hwang]

I would say that my response would be aligned with Dr. Moran's.

On projects that we are involved with, I can give an example. We are operating a data system that has information on salmon populations and their habitat. Some of that data is pulled in from federal and provincial government sources. Some of it is generated by community sources. Some of that community information is first nations community and local indigenous knowledge.

Some of those indigenous entities are very comfortable with the information they provide being displayed publicly on our system. But our system also has capacity to have their information displayed only when they are comfortable sharing it, so they get to turn it on and off.

The suite of data we have in our system is a combination of publicly available data and data that is being derived from local sources. Some of that is broadly public and for some of it there is more limited access.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Thank you.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Corey Tochor]

Thank you to our witness and to MP Lobb.

We are now moving on to MP Lauzon.

[Stéphane Lauzon, Liberal, Argenteuil—La Petite-Nation, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'd like to thank the two witnesses who are here today.

You talked to us a lot about partnerships with organizations and citizen participants. You also talked about collaboration with the indigenous communities.

I saw something special happen this year in Quebec: on January 23, the City of Victoriaville was one of the first cities with a population of 50,000 and under to create the position of municipal science advisor. So I wonder about something.

Given that municipalities and indigenous communities are the ones that know their jurisdictions and the bodies of water located there best, would it be a good idea for the federal government to encourage the other municipalities in Canada to create that kind of position?

Ms. Moran, you can answer first, if you like.

[Dr. Kathryn Moran]

That's a wonderful question. I would say that would be a wonderful thing to do. From our experience working with indigenous communities, there's a very big discrepancy among those communities. For example, some have the capacity to invest in scientific studies to identify their priorities and what they need to do to protect their own coastlines. Others don't.

However, if all of them had the potential to have scientific advisers—even non-indigenous communities, as well—it would be of great benefit. The programs could be launched with a much more focused directive in terms of what the priorities and needs are. As Jason mentioned, the benefits back to the community would be much stronger.

[Stéphane Lauzon, Liberal, Argenteuil—La Petite-Nation, QC]

What do you say, Mr. Hwang?

[Jason Hwang]

I would agree entirely with what Dr. Moran just said. I'll add a bit, in that I think it's a wonderful idea.

I would highlight that one of the most useful things that can be done to support science is to help people understand and interpret it. Science itself is a method. You ask a question, you do a study and you get some results. However, what do you do with those results, and how do you interpret and apply them to issues that are important, and to important decisions that you have to make?

I admire the community of Victoriaville for having the foresight to appoint a science officer. I think that's wonderful. I'd like to see more more of that, but not just at the municipal level.

Helping all entities better understand the science and interpret it so that they can use that information in the most informed and thoughtful way would be excellent.

[Stéphane Lauzon, Liberal, Argenteuil—La Petite-Nation, QC]

Your organization has an exceptional number of volunteers.

What ties do you have with the municipalities, and what can they contribute in terms of these independent researchers?

[Jason Hwang]

It's variable. I would say that for the most part—at least in the work that I'm very familiar with, which is around salmon—most municipalities that have salmon within their jurisdiction or area are very interested in the salmon resources. Salmon are in their rivers, their lakes and their streams. These are important areas to our communities.

I would say, though, that the support is ad hoc. It's not structured. There's a sense of a value and an appreciation for the work that's done, but I think there's a lot more that could be done in helping from the municipal level to identify what the priorities are in that municipality.

How could local, municipal governments develop just a bit of structure, as I was speaking to in my opening comments, to help let their citizens know what they can use help with, how we can help them and what can we do with that information to turn that into something?

I think the openness is there, but I don't think it has been activated as well as it could have been.

[Stéphane Lauzon, Liberal, Argenteuil—La Petite-Nation, QC]

Thank you.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Corey Tochor]

Thank you so much.

Now we'll move on to our two-and-a-half-minute rounds. We have, from the Bloc, MP Blanchette-Joncas.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My questions are for you, Ms. Moran. Thank you for being here for this important study.

I have taken a look at your organization, which I think is extraordinary. You have a lot of competencies and knowledge, particularly when it comes to marine geotechnics and marine tectonics. I commend you for that and applaud your organization's mission.

Ms. Moran, I have visited your organization's website and skimmed through the annual reports. I noticed that your website is not fully translated into French. However, I want to commend the efforts made by your organization. It states that the French translation is "coming soon". I would like to know how much time "coming soon" equates to.

Ms. Moran, with respect, your organization receives an enormous amount of money from the federal government. We are talking about funding of over $25 million dollars in a year, which is not a trifling amount.

I am humbly wondering: how many million dollars do you need to maintain an internet site, and publish communications, in both official languages?

[Dr. Kathryn Moran]

We have been slow at translating everything in both official languages. For example, we have had this as a priority. You can say that $25 million a year is quite a large sum. To give you context, we are equivalent to a U.S. observatory, and their funding is about one third greater than ours. We are very efficient and good at what we do. Of course, we are dedicated to making that happen soon.

Our new funding will start April 1 of this year from the Canada Foundation for Innovation. In our proposal to them.... For example, when we put a proposal in, we identify all the aspects that we need to do to move forward. There has been no full requirement for this, but, in our proposal this time, we've included that. That's why it says "coming soon".

We're going to continue to move forward with that. We're getting great advice—

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Ms. Moran, forgive me for interrupting you, but I am running out of time.

I note that your organization obviously embraces the values of equity, diversity and inclusion.

When it comes to linguistic diversity, is the presence of French included in your priorities?

Do you embrace that too?

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Corey Tochor]

I'm sorry; we're over time on that one.

[Dr. Kathryn Moran]

Absolutely. Yes, and we'd love to talk more about that.