Science and Research Committee on Oct. 25th, 2023

[The Chair, Liberal, Lloyd Longfield]

Welcome to meeting number 60 of the Standing Committee on Science and Research.

Today's meeting is taking place in a hybrid format, pursuant to the Standing Orders. Members are attending in person in the room. We are all in the room today. We're not on Zoom, so we can dispense with those comments and get to our study.

Please wait until I recognize you before speaking.

Thank you to all the witnesses for being here and for waiting for us to do our voting duty in the House.

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(3)(i) and the motion adopted by the committee on Tuesday, June 6, 2023, the committee resumes its study on the use of federal government research and development grants, funds and contributions by Canadian universities and research institutes in partnerships with entities connected to the People's Republic of China.

It's my pleasure now to welcome our witnesses today.

From the Natural Sciences and Engineering Research Council, we have Alejandro Adem and Manal Bahubeshi.

From the Canadian Institutes of Health Research, we have Christian Baron, vice-president of research programs.

From the Social Sciences and Humanities Research Council, we have Ted Hewitt back. It's good to see you, Ted. We also have Valérie La Traverse, vice-president of corporate affairs, and Valérie Laflamme, associate vice-president of TIPS.

You'll each have five minutes for your opening remarks. We can get right into that now, starting with NSERC.

[Dr. Alejandro Adem, President, Natural Sciences and Engineering Research Council]

Good evening, Mr. Chair and members of the committee.

My name is Alejandro Adem. I am the president of the Natural Sciences and Engineering Research Council of Canada, our country's federal funding agency for university and college-based research in the natural sciences and engineering.

Thank you for this opportunity to appear before you today to discuss this critical issue. Protecting the integrity of our research system is critical for our country's continued prosperity, especially with advances in critical areas like artificial intelligence and quantum technologies.

NSERC takes the issue of safeguarding Canada’s research ecosystem very seriously and, like you, we want to ensure that we take the necessary steps to protect our research assets.

We appreciate Minister Champagne’s initiative in advancing this important priority, as well as the broad support received from other members of Parliament and policy makers across the Government of Canada.

Research security is a shared responsibility that requires a coordinated approach across all stakeholders. We have been able to move swiftly because of this unified support.

Striking the balance between research that is open and secure requires thoughtful implementation, and we have every indication so far that we are progressing on the right path.

Along with other partners in the Government of Canada, the granting agencies continue to work with the university community to provide resources, tools and training for researchers and institutions in order to build their knowledge of, and capacity for, research security. These resources are made available through Canada's safeguarding your research web portal.

Since July 2021, NSERC has furthered its commitment to research security by implementing the national security guidelines for research partnerships in NSERC's flagship research partnerships program, the alliance program. Following these guidelines, researchers and institutions seeking to partner with a private sector organization must complete a risk assessment form to identify potential risks and provide an appropriate risk mitigation plan. If the grant is funded, this mitigation plan must be implemented for the duration of the grant.

The information researchers have provided demonstrates that they have developed a strong understanding of the risks associated with their research and with their partners. As a result, the risk to research security for the vast majority of applications—in fact, 96%—has been low and appropriately mitigated. The remaining 4% of applications are those where NSERC required expert advice from Canada's national security departments and agencies to inform our funding decisions. In many cases, the advice received was that the risks were well mitigated. Accordingly, NSERC funded those grants.

NSERC remains steadfast in our efforts to ensure that the research we fund benefits Canada. We do not fund grants where we are advised the research partnership poses an unmitigable risk to national security.

We also recognize and welcome the enhanced policy direction requested in February 2023, regarding our most sensitive technology research areas and affiliations to universities, research institutes, and laboratories connected to military, national defence, or state security entities of foreign state actors that pose a risk to Canada’s national security.

At the same time, we must bear in mind that collaboration is an essential part of advancing the aims of the research we fund. This is why, in parallel to our research security commitments, NSERC has continued to foster international initiatives that support an open and connected research ecosystem.

In the past year alone, we've launched joint initiatives with science funders in the U.S., the U.K. and Australia, as part of the National Science Foundation's global centres, to tackle climate change and clean energy challenges; established a new partnership with the National Research Agency in France; and issued a special international funding opportunity in support of Canada's national quantum strategy.

We have also benefited greatly from the perspectives of these international partners—bilaterally and through multilateral dialogues such as the Five Eyes, the G7 and the Global Research Council—as concerns about research security are shared by funding agencies around the world. Most notably, Canada co-chairs the G7 working group on the security and integrity of the global research ecosystem, SIGRE, which published a set of guiding principles on research security last year. NSERC adheres to these principles.

As a leading supporter of discovery and innovation in this country, NSERC's vision remains focused on supporting our researchers today, so Canadians benefit tomorrow. Along with the important standards we've introduced to address research security risks, we must continue to foster our young talent and give them the means to pursue their research goals in Canada to ensure that our homegrown discoveries and innovations reach Canadians fast and first.

Thank you for inviting my colleague and me to appear here today.

I’ll be happy to answer any questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lloyd Longfield]

Perfect, thank you. That was right on time.

Now we will move to the Canadian Institutes of Health Research, please.

[Christian Baron, Vice-President, Research - Programs, Canadian Institutes of Health Research]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I would like to begin by thanking the committee for the invitation to appear before you today and for drawing attention to an important topic for the research ecosystem in Canada.

At CIHR, we recognize the importance of academic freedom, openness and international research collaboration in making the ground-breaking discoveries that improve lives. That is why we are working on promoting those values. We all know that health threats we face are increasingly global in nature, and that the health and well-being of Canadians is intertwined and dependent on the well-being of people everywhere.

To tackle complex health challenges, we must continue working with colleagues around the world to leverage our shared knowledge and resources so that we can find solutions for all.

To advance this global research agenda, CIHR currently has 40 international initiatives supported by agreements with countries around the world. For example, this includes the European Union's joint program on neurodegenerative disease research, which is the largest global research initiative aimed at tackling the challenge of neurodegenerative diseases. It is aimed at finding causes and developing cures and better ways of care.

As part of the work that your committee is currently conducting, CIHR has two active partnerships with the People's Republic of China. They are managed through the National Natural Science Foundation of China, or the NSFC, whose mandate is to support basic research and free exploration, identify and foster scientific talents, and promote progress in science and technology.

The first agreement represents a five-year, $12.2-million investment, of which $6.4 million is provided by the NSFC to the Global Alliance for Chronic Diseases' call for research on mental health. Through this particular initiative, seven research teams have been funded over a period of five years. As an example, this includes a team led by Dr. Brian Mishara at l'Université du Québec à Montréal, who developed a project on a World Health Organization intervention program for people who have experienced suicide attempts, in parallel projects in Ningxia, China, and among the Inuit community in Nunavut, Canada. This study is only one example of how international research can help us to understand how interventions work in different contexts.

The second partnership is to support the healthy life trajectories Canada-China team, in collaboration with the NSFC and the World Health Organization, to address the increasing rates of obesity, particularly among youth. This partnership was renewed in 2022 with a $2.5-million investment from China and matching funding from CIHR. This international approach enables the sharing of expertise, the comparative analysis of interventions, the harmonization of data and the assessment of biological mechanisms in different populations, all of which contribute to delivering greater impact in comparison to single-country projects.

While these global health initiatives have great potential to improve health, the globalization of research has also made us more vulnerable to threats from entities of concern. This is why, given the shared responsibility of creating a vigilant while open and collaborative ecosystem, we have been working closely with our federal partners, national security agencies, academic institutions and researchers to protect Canada's research investment.

In addition to the critical tri-agency work that my colleagues have described, CIHR has implemented a new requirement as part of its strategic funding opportunities for applicants to describe the role of all applicant partners and how they will be involved and contribute to research-related activities. As part of this process, risk and/or conflict of interest should also be explained, if applicable.

CIHR's strategic plan sets out ambitious goals to be achieved by 2031 to ensure that Canadian health research is recognized internationally as inclusive, collaborative, transparent, culturally sensitive and focused on tangible benefits.

In alignment with this commitment, CIHR is working to enhance national and international collaboration to address global challenges and facilitate the pooling of expertise and sharing of infrastructure.

In closing, let me remind you that research security is a shared responsibility between the federal government and academic institutions. The stakes are high, and we must continue to work together to strike a balance between openness and security to protect our country's research.

Thank you for your time. I look forward to taking your questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lloyd Longfield]

Thank you very much.

Finally, on this panel, we will go over to Mr. Hewitt from SSHRC for five minutes.

[Dr. Ted Hewitt, President, Social Sciences and Humanities Research Council]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'm very happy to be here with my colleagues Valérie La Traverse and Valérie Laflamme.

I'm sure all of us in the room agree that science and research have become more important than ever in the current environment as economic, environmental and social challenges have become as serious as they are complex.

Expanding knowledge across all disciplines is foundational to innovation and to finding solutions that will enhance health, combat climate change, and drive economic and social prosperity.

The Social Sciences and Humanities Research Council, SSHRC, plays a key role in Canada’s research ecosystem, as the federal agency that supports research and talent in the humanities and social sciences, and as the agency that administers a number of prestigious national programs—such as the Canada research chairs program and the new frontiers in research fund—on behalf of the three federal research funding agencies.

SSHRC recognizes the crucial need to protect Canadian research from risks such as theft, foreign interference or the unwanted transfer of knowledge. We have been collaborating with government partners and consulting with the research community to develop and implement the national security guidelines for research partnerships.

Following the February 2023 statement by the Minister of Innovation, Science and Industry, the Minister of Public Safety, and the Minister of Health, we are also contributing to the development of a new interdepartmental policy on sensitive technology research and affiliations of concern.

To help the research community meet these requirements, in 2022, we began providing $125 million over five years to Canadian institutions through the research support fund to help them enhance their research security capacities. We also engage with the Government of Canada-Universities Working Group and other federal government partners to provide the research community with tools, resources and information sessions.

Given growing geopolitical tensions and rivalries, it is imperative that Canadian researchers have the necessary tools and knowledge to safeguard their work.

However, it's also important to point out that international collaborations, including those with researchers and institutions based in China, remain vital to Canada's research enterprise and provide a basis for science diplomacy. Researchers need to work together across disciplines, sectors and borders to understand and respond to global challenges, whether they involve a global pandemic or the climate crisis, and it's crucial to maintain open channels of communication between scientific communities in times of crisis and to promote collaborations in other areas of mutual interest.

For instance, SSHRC is currently funding a research partnership among scientists from Canada, China, Costa Rica, the United States, Ghana, France and other countries aimed at feeding the future human population in a just and equitable way, while also achieving biodiversity conservation and climate change mitigation goals.

The challenges facing Canada and the world today are frequently interconnected problems. They require that we cooperate on shared priorities while remaining vigilant about potential risks and steadfast in our efforts to protect the integrity of our research system.

This reality reinforces that the Government of Canada, the granting agencies, the Canada Foundation for Innovation and the research community at large must all work together on this shared responsibility. Indeed, the Canadian research community comprises a vast range of experts on national security issues, science and innovation policy and international relations. This expertise could contribute to the Government of Canada's research security efforts.

It is also our shared responsibility to ensure that security measures do not lead to discrimination against, or the profiling of, any member of the community—including on the basis of nationality.

The granting agencies, the Canada Foundation for Innovation and their federal partners will continue to work with the research community to implement research security measures. But my colleagues and I believe that it's important that we continue to take an evidence-based approach and look at the broader implications.

As stated in a House of Commons unanimous motion in May 2021, we must affirm our “commitment to science, research and evidence-informed decision-making”. In doing so, I'm confident that we can better protect Canada's research ecosystem from security risks while continuing to foster international collaboration on areas of mutual interest.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lloyd Longfield]

Thank you.

Each panel from our research tri-council is right on time—precision, we love it.

Speaking of precision, we have six minutes for Mr. Lobb.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Thanks very much, Mr. Chair.

Welcome to our guests.

My first question is for Mr. Hewitt.

I promise that I won't ask you about the Dolly Parton lyrics.

[Dr. Ted Hewitt]

I knew you were going to do that.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

I always have to remind you about that, but I promise I won't ask you about that today.

I just want to clarify something you said in your speech. I want to make sure that I have the numbers right, because I was writing it down. Was that $125 million for security research?

[Dr. Ted Hewitt]

Yes. It was provided to SSHRC on behalf of the agencies to provide institutions with the funds they need to develop their own security measures locally.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Did that $125 million go directly to your department?

[Dr. Ted Hewitt]

It went through our department—through mechanisms we've established that are run by Madame Laflamme, who can give you more detail about that—and was distributed and is being distributed to institutions for the purpose—

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

That's to the universities.

[Dr. Ted Hewitt]

Yes, absolutely.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

They took that money and they built a portal. Is that what they did?

[Dr. Ted Hewitt]

They do a lot of different things.

In fact, they propose to us the kinds of things they need to do locally to meet security requirements, and then we fund them on that basis. That can vary, as you can imagine, between institutions, depending on where they're at or how far along they are in their own security measures.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

With this $125 million, do you work in conjunction with CSIS, the RCMP or other intelligence agencies? Is that a requirement for the funding to go to the universities or is it given to the universities and then they decide what to do?

[Dr. Ted Hewitt]

I'd ask Valérie to speak to that if she's able to, but the point is that the money is provided to institutions based on their needs and on their understanding of what they need to do to enhance their own security measures. It's provided on that basis. I don't believe there's any screening that occurs through security agencies at this point. It's to help them build infrastructure in terms of what they need.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

That's fair enough.

That does raise an interesting question, probably for another meeting. No offence to any of the universities, but they were a little naive to this anyway, so it may be hard for them to establish what they need or don't need.

Thank you for that information. That is appreciated.

Mr. Baron, in your statement, I thought you mentioned actively or proactively working with security agencies. Did you say that in your statement or did I catch that wrong?

[Christian Baron]

Thank you for the question, Mr. Chair.

Certainly, CIHR, together with our colleagues from the other councils, has worked over the last few months to establish parameters and procedures for the new security posture. This was a very interactive procedure, where the three councils worked together with the national security agencies, including CSIS. It was a very collaborative, interactive process in trying to find the best solution that would protect Canadian research investments.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Based on what we heard here, the three agencies that are here today worked with the security agencies, but then the money went to the universities. Then, at that point, it's kind of hands-off, and we let the universities figure out what they need. Is there a potential for a disconnect if that's what we're doing?

[Christian Baron]

The procedure is as follows. In addition to the work that was done conjointly with the three councils, there was also a committee established with the universities. It was aimed at establishing and discussing the needs of universities. Based on all of these considerations, including conversations at the top secret level with university officials, the guidelines were established and funds were allocated to universities.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Okay.

I still have time.

Mr. Adem and Ms. Bahubeshi, there's a question I have for you folks.

I appreciate everybody's presentations today.

The universities fill out a form. The applicants fill it out. Is it your portal or their portal?