Evidence of meeting #40 for Science and Research in the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was scientific.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Bloc
Maxime Blanchette-Joncas Bloc Rimouski—La Matapédia, QC
Okay, thank you very much.
Ms. Nemer, you've previously told the committee that you recognize that science in French is essential to the dissemination of knowledge. I would like to know your opinion on the most recent report that the government commissioned regarding potential solutions for improving science in French.
I understand that you've had discussions with government officials. What do you think are the priority courses of action to be implemented very soon?
Chief Science Advisor of Canada, Office of the Chief Science Advisor of Canada
When you call them priorities, I imagine you're referring to the steps we can take to start seeing results. I think there are many things that need to be done.
When the government provides grants or funding, there are conditions attached. I think it would be a good start if all agencies that receive research funding were asked to report on the number of francophones who have applied for and received grants. I plan to ask Statistics Canada to provide me with the number of theses that have been submitted in French and the number of francophones in certain fields.
In other words, we have to start by gathering data. Once we have data, we can take meaningful action.
That doesn't prevent us, in the meantime, from helping the Association canadienne-française pour l'avancement des sciences, for example, to continue promoting the role of French.
We also need to be able to use French translations. For scientific texts, that isn't being done very well yet. So that could be a research project in and of itself.
Bloc
Maxime Blanchette-Joncas Bloc Rimouski—La Matapédia, QC
I want to revisit an idea you proposed to us at the time—namely, to establish an office for science in French to monitor and coordinate efforts and measure progress.
Would you still agree that this office should be attached to the office of the chief science adviser of Canada?
Chief Science Advisor of Canada, Office of the Chief Science Advisor of Canada
That's one possibility. If the government asked me to take on that responsibility, I would be more than happy to do so.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Salma Zahid
Thank you. The time is up.
With that, we will proceed to MP Baldinelli for five minutes.
Please go ahead.
Conservative
Tony Baldinelli Conservative Niagara Falls—Niagara-on-the-Lake, ON
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Dr. Nemer.
I'm going to follow up on my colleague's line of questioning earlier. Unfortunately, she didn't get her question in. She mentioned the disappointment that it was for all of us to learn that you have not met with the Prime Minister. I mean, those kinds of meetings are important. They're signals. This makes it appear that science is a low priority, you know, which fits with the theme and the trend we've seen recently.
For example, with the agricultural research centres, 75% of the total financial cuts to the Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food come at the expense of the science and research branch. In March, just after your last appearance, $20 million was cut from the strategic science fund. Again in March, the Canadian Space Agency announced cuts to the lunar rover mission.
These are sad signals, if I can be quite honest. They point to science becoming a low priority for the government. In your comments, you talked about “zigzag funding” not being good for science. I want to give you a chance to respond to that and to express your feelings with respect to some of those cuts. What does this say about the government's commitment to science and scientific research?
Chief Science Advisor of Canada, Office of the Chief Science Advisor of Canada
Thank you, Madam Chair.
I'm going to perhaps express views based on data, because I don't think my feelings are really important in this situation.
I would start by saying that, from where I sit, I don't see at all a disinterest in science and research. I think the commitment for $1.7 billion to attract talent is quite telling. It's a significant amount of funding—
Conservative
Tony Baldinelli Conservative Niagara Falls—Niagara-on-the-Lake, ON
It's still less than the $21 billion they spend on outside consultants. Wouldn't it have been better that this government take direction to cut $21 billion on outside consultants and put that into the agricultural research centres and put it back into public funding for our university streams, for example?
I mean, my God, we have a recent report from Monday, June 1, that talks about the Center for World University Rankings. Out of 38 universities in Canada, 37 dropped. Only one stayed the same.
Liberal
Conservative
Conservative
Liberal
Taleeb Noormohamed Liberal Vancouver Granville, BC
Is this within the scope of the chief science adviser?
Conservative
Tony Baldinelli Conservative Niagara Falls—Niagara-on-the-Lake, ON
I'm just asking with regard to science.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Salma Zahid
We're getting into debate.
Thank you, MP Noormohamed.
Thank you, MP Baldinelli.
Conservative
Tony Baldinelli Conservative Niagara Falls—Niagara-on-the-Lake, ON
Are you not concerned? Those precious dollars that we do spend are needed not only at our departments, but also at the U15 and all the universities. In fact, I have the number one research college in all of Canada. At the college and CEGEP levels, they got maybe $500 million of the over $10 billion to go for that, for core research funding. Wouldn't it have been better if the government...?
Or do you not believe that some of the dollars the government is spending on outside consultants would be better placed inside government to advance research? This is not only for universities and colleges, but for departments, and to keep those workers at the Agriculture and Agri-Food department so that we can continue to do the excellent work being performed at those seven centres by those workers, who are going to be losing their jobs.
Chief Science Advisor of Canada, Office of the Chief Science Advisor of Canada
Madam Chair, I just want to reaffirm that I feel strongly about science. I'm a science champion, and I think we need to look at the entirety of the portrait. For example, on the investment that we are providing in security and defence, the Prime Minister has been very clear from the beginning that this includes substantive investments for R and D, including both civilian, of course, and dual use. There will be funds that actually will be going to universities and to industry for this.
Conservative
Tony Baldinelli Conservative Niagara Falls—Niagara-on-the-Lake, ON
To your point—and thank you for that—you also talked about your agency and providing advice, not only on science research but on science infrastructure as well. Was your office ever consulted with regard to the $200 million that is being spent on the spaceport in Canso, Nova Scotia? Have you seen that site?
Chief Science Advisor of Canada, Office of the Chief Science Advisor of Canada
My office was not consulted. I have not seen the site.
Conservative
Chief Science Advisor of Canada, Office of the Chief Science Advisor of Canada
If you're interested, I can give you some scientific notes here. I looked at what was so special about this site versus other sites for satellite launch. It turns out that, because of where we want the satellites to be and the curvature of the earth, this actually is a very good place to directly launch the satellites.
Conservative