Evidence of meeting #24 for Status of Women in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was communities.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Pamela Shauk  Outreach Worker, Native Friendship Centre of Montreal Inc.
Carrie Martin  Evaluation Coordinator, Native Women's Shelter of Montreal
Nakuset  Executive Director, Native Women's Shelter of Montreal
Carole Brazeau  Justice and Public Security Coordinator, Quebec Native Women Inc.
France Robertson  Coordinator for the women's shelter and non-violence file, Quebec Native Women Inc.
Ellen Gabriel  President, Quebec Native Women Inc.
Béatrice Vaugrante  Executive Director, Canada francophone Section, Amnesty International
Karine Gentelet  Coordinator of aboriginal rights, Canadian Francophone Section, Amnesty International
Émilie-Cloé Laliberté  General Coordinator, Stella
Isabelle Dumas  Procedural Clerk
Julie Cool  Committee Researcher
Laura Munn-Rivard  Committee Researcher
Marie-Pierre Bousquet  Associate Professor, Faculty of Anthropology, University of Montreal, As an Individual
Mylène Jaccoud  Full Professor, School of Criminology, Université de Montréal, As an Individual

11:25 a.m.

NDP

Irene Mathyssen NDP London—Fanshawe, ON

So your funding ended in March?

11:25 a.m.

Evaluation Coordinator, Native Women's Shelter of Montreal

Carrie Martin

Yes, it was a four-year contribution agreement with public health and it ended March 31.

11:25 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

And you have reapplied?

11:25 a.m.

Evaluation Coordinator, Native Women's Shelter of Montreal

11:25 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Does anyone else want to jump in? Just put your hand up.

Ms. Vaugrante.

11:25 a.m.

Executive Director, Canada francophone Section, Amnesty International

Béatrice Vaugrante

With regard to the more general question of criminalization, what we noted in our research is that the take that police officers have on criminal aboriginal women who are in prostitution rings will often be immediately based on their so-called high-risk lifestyle.

Often they'll disregard the mitigating circumstances as a result of which those women, who have suffered violence and numerous rights violations, wind up in those rings. They're going to manage the criminal problem, but they won't go any further, for lack of a protocol, to see whether there is a story behind all that or rights violations.

These women will immediately be considered as dangerous, since their lifestyle is considered risky. That leads us to judge on prejudices. An aboriginal woman is necessarily at slightly greater risk. This criminalization persists in the system, instead of people looking beneath the surface, at the story of those women, all the violence they have suffered, which has forced them into those rings. It's like other women, of course, but there is a double discrimination against aboriginal women.

11:25 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Ms. Nakuset.

11:25 a.m.

Executive Director, Native Women's Shelter of Montreal

Nakuset

I just want to talk a little bit about the Aboriginal Healing Foundation.

In 2000 the Native Women's Shelter had a project called Moving Towards the Seventh Generation. It was directed at reversing the effects of residential schools. We had it from 2000. It was cut on March 31 of this year, and the implications are humongous. We had so many different physicians over the years in order to help our women heal from the effects of residential school and also the intergenerational effects, because not all the women may have gone to residential school, but their mothers did, and therefore they lost their language, their way of life.

I'm going to try to keep this as short as possible, because I could really talk about it for a long time.

It's really huge that we've lost it. I think there is some documentation saying that residential schools opened in the 1600s, so there are so many years that we had residential schools, and yet they only give us 10 years to heal. It's not enough, and we are trying to make a lot of awareness about this issue and to see how we can have it reinstated, because there are women who come to our shelter for the services we used to provide.

We had an enormous number of services through the Aboriginal Healing Foundation, and now we have basic services just for the women, so we actually have to let women know, “Well, we no longer offer that.” They would sometimes send women from northern communities, not because they were homeless or for whatever issue, but they were coming because of the services, because they knew they could see an art therapist and a psychotherapist, and that we had traditional healers there. And they were coming for the workshops.

So it's huge. I guess if you have questions later on.... I don't want to say too much.

Thank you.

11:30 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Does anybody else want to jump in?

I'll move on. We have a list of people here.

Ms. Simson.

11:30 a.m.

Liberal

Michelle Simson Liberal Scarborough Southwest, ON

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I would just simply like to thank all of you for being here this morning.

We've been studying this for a number of weeks now, and we've heard from witnesses. The common thread that most of the witnesses have brought forward is the impact the residential school system has had on the community in general.

Since you've identified that--and it will take time, and I understand that--how much time do you think it's going to take before it's basically not the same issue that it was? Or is this something that will be carried forward? What sorts of solutions are there? Shelters are great for the women in the short term, to get them out of horrible situations, but how best can the government help you deal with the residential school system having as big an impact as it has right now? Are you having any success stories in terms of the type of work you're doing to help people get beyond it and to become successful and healthy?

11:30 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Ms. Gabriel.

11:30 a.m.

President, Quebec Native Women Inc.

Ellen Gabriel

I'm not sure if you're addressing the question to Nakuset.

11:30 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

We're running a round table here. If you want to jump in, put your hand up and we'll just make sure we have a list of your names.

11:30 a.m.

President, Quebec Native Women Inc.

Ellen Gabriel

I think one of the weaknesses in things like the Aboriginal Healing Foundation is that it has a time limit; it has an expiry date. What we need in the communities and for the urban aboriginal people are programs that are recurring.

We also need to get the provinces and territories involved, because they don't contribute anything at all. If we use a clinic, the federal government is the one that pays, and yet the provinces use our territories and resources as well. So we need to get all the crown actors involved to help us create these programs that will be perpetuated, that don't have an expiry date. The inconsistency in creating pilot projects has created more damage than anything, because you get people who are on the road to healing and then we have to say, “I'm sorry, there's no more funding for you.” So they either quit the road to healing or they try to find other ways to deal with it.

One of the things that I think is also problematic is that as long as you have assimilation policies that do not recognize the importance and the preciousness of our languages, we are going to lose traditional knowledge, which is the basis for our health and well-being. We are going to continue to lose people.

I've spoken with a front-line worker who works in the James Bay area, and she said she was experiencing a lot of suicides in their community. She said all of them were related to the residential school system. It has not helped. You can give money to people and say, “I'm sorry this happened to you”, but unless they are actually supported--and in our community, not just in urban areas--we are burning out our social workers, because there's not enough of them. They go to the grocery store and someone comes up to them and says, “By the way, could you help me with this?” We don't have enough human resources, trained people, in our communities.

We have these projects that give certificates and don't provide enough opportunities for people to have.... It doesn't validate it. It just kind of says, “Okay, we'll give you a bit of knowledge to become social workers or police officers, but you're really not equivalent. You can't work anywhere except on the reserve.” Our people are everywhere, and we should be able to have access to those programs.

I can't emphasize enough that the government and all the crown actors have to become involved in the decolonization process. They have to start listening to our needs. They can't just throw a bit of money here and there and say, look at the wonderful things we've done for aboriginal people. The Department of Indian Affairs sucks about 64% to 67% of the money that's allocated for aboriginal people and we're left with crumbs. We have been in the process of trying to get out of the colonization, but we cannot do it if every time there are criteria and policies that restrict our ability and freedom to be able to help our people adequately.

11:35 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Thank you.

Ms. Vaugrante.

11:35 a.m.

Executive Director, Canada francophone Section, Amnesty International

Béatrice Vaugrante

I believe that one of the ways of getting over the effects of the residential schools would be to stop perpetuating the phenomenon today. As I said earlier, three times as many children are being placed outside their communities and families today than there were at the peak time of the residential schools.

Social programs are under-funded. Twenty-two per cent fewer child protection services are offered for aboriginal children than for non-aboriginal children. And yet, because they live in remote areas, the costs are higher and, in addition, the needs are much greater. The situation is the same for health and education. There is a systemic factor that doesn't help matters. Some programs are under federal jurisdiction, whereas others are provincial. So there's a lack of coordination between the two orders of government, as a result of which there is now discrimination within a single province.

Furthermore, a case is currently being heard by the Canadian Human Rights Tribunal, concerning the under-funding of family services for children. The government claims there is no discrimination, that aboriginal children receive the same amount. It's not right to present these kinds of arguments before the tribunal. In Canada today, no one should discriminate between an aboriginal and a non-aboriginal child. So discrimination must stop. What would make a woman and her family stay together? She would have to have a life with dignity, an income and access to health and education services. In that case as well, no one should think based solely on social programs; you also have to think on the basis of economic independence.

I don't believe these people want to live on charity forever. There are funds and programs, but it's like a band-aid on a cancer. We have to work to find solutions so the communities can manage to become economically independent. The same is true for women, so that they no longer suffer violence. This implies consultation and cooperation when it comes to land use. Whether it's to open a mine, build a dam or establish a forest business, the Supreme Court asks that the local populations be consulted. It's not done without them. People have to stop opposing rights, particularly in the regions.

We conducted a research project of international scope in Wendake, Quebec. In the regions, we sense these things. From the point of view of rights, I very well understand why local workers want to have work and a plant. That's clearly important, but, at the government level, they can't always rely on oppositions, such as when people say that aboriginal people are a burden on them. There has to be work for aboriginals and non-aboriginals. We have to try to find solutions together, through consultation.

Not all aboriginal people want to limit themselves to traditional activities. They also want modern economic development in their communities and economic self-sufficiency that enables them to live in dignity. In view of the fact that 40% of housing units are over-populated, there is necessarily tension within families. However, financial resources and economic self-sufficiency would make it possible to build houses. I believe that would contribute a great deal to reducing violence.

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Yes, Ms. Laliberté.

11:40 a.m.

General Coordinator, Stella

Émilie-Cloé Laliberté

Obviously, it's already been said that we have to invest in existing aboriginal resources, but we should also implement programs enabling people from the community to become multiplying agents. They themselves could intervene with their peers. Everything should be funded in a sustainable manner.

There also has to be an end to criminalization. I want to raise the veil on a repressive practice that is common in Montreal, the distribution of quadrangles. Women, whether they are homeless or sex workers, are prohibited from moving within a given area. If they don't comply, they are sent directly to prison. The quadrangles are usually between Saint-Urbain, Viau, Notre-Dame and Sherbrooke streets. These women therefore cannot frequent those areas. According to Health Canada statistics, 25% of the correctional population consists of aboriginal women, whereas they represent 3% of the general population. There really has to be an end to quadrangles. The women who live in those neighbourhoods hang around in the dark corners, sheltered from police officers, but they then run risks. That's where they suffer the most violence.

An enormous amount of work also has to be done to educate the police. Earlier we talked about the mere right to file a complaint when you suffer sexual assault or violence. In the past 15 years, we've tried to sensitize and educate the police officers, but it's only in the past year that we've established an agreement with three women police officers. The goal is for women who suffer a sexual assault, whether or not there is an arrest warrant out for them, to be able to file a complaint against their attackers. The agreement shouldn't just involve three female police officers, but other all police services.

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Anyone else?

Monsieur Desnoyers, do you have something?

11:40 a.m.

Evaluation Coordinator, Native Women's Shelter of Montreal

Carrie Martin

May I just add one quick thing?

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Yes, absolutely, Ms. Martin.

11:40 a.m.

Evaluation Coordinator, Native Women's Shelter of Montreal

Carrie Martin

The money that had previously been allocated to the Aboriginal Healing Foundation was then redistributed through Health Canada; we have been encouraged to take advantage of what is offered through Health Canada. But the shelter has been leaving numerous messages with the regional director, asking to set up a meeting just to understand what is available to our clients--what funding is available, what services, what programs--and they have yet to call us back. The funding was cut at the end of March, and we still cannot get in touch with Health Canada to find out what we can use.

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Michelle, was there anything you wanted to say?

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

Michelle Simson Liberal Scarborough Southwest, ON

No, thank you.

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

No? Not at the moment. Thanks.

Monsieur Desnoyers.