Status of Women Committee on Sept. 16th, 2024

[Lisa Hepfner, Liberal, Hamilton Mountain, ON]

I just want to clarify, Madam Chair, because you're talking today as though you didn't know that it was inappropriate to call a meeting without informing the witnesses and to call witnesses without informing committee members. Is that your contention—that you didn't know that this is an inappropriate way to handle a committee? Are you just learning this now?

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

No, it was an emergency meeting, and I acted swiftly on a very emergent topic, hence the meeting.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

Madam Chair, in an emergency meeting, all committee members are present. If it's an emergency meeting, we should say our views too for names of our witnesses. How come we didn't get a chance to submit them? Even though it was an emergency meeting, we had a lot of emergency meetings in COVID time, and all the time, but this never happened in that time.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

I really appreciate your feedback, and more consensus from different witnesses would only enhance the conversation next time.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Madam Chair, I would like to speak.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Go ahead, Mr. Serré.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Normally, emergency meetings are requested pursuant to Standing Order 106(4). We're used to that. Such meetings were held over the summer, as well as during the COVID‑19 pandemic. As Ms. Larouche mentioned, we held an emergency meeting under Standing Order 106(4) in July 2020, as well as in 2022.

It was reported in the media that the meeting in question was requested pursuant to Standing Order 106(4), but that isn't the case. When a meeting is requested pursuant to the standing order, all parties have the opportunity to invite witnesses, and the chair must convene the meeting within five days of receiving the request. However, in this case, it wasn't a meeting requested by parliamentarians pursuant to Standing Order 106(4). Instead, it seems to be a meeting that you called yourself. Perhaps I understand your approach a little better but, with all due respect, this isn't a meeting requested under Standing Order 106(4) like the ones we're used to having as parliamentarians.

It's important that all parties be involved, so that they have a chance to prepare, propose the names of witnesses and know which witnesses will appear. That allows all political parties to be part of the conversation. By calling an emergency meeting of your own volition rather than making a request under Standing Order 106(4), you made that impossible. I've been here for eight years, a little less than Ms. Sidhu, and I've never seen that happen at this committee either. In fact, the Conservatives have been managing the committee's meetings since 2015.

I want to take this opportunity to thank you for bringing in the budget today. Now we can discuss it at greater length.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

I think.... Anna, I know you also have your hand up, but I would like to acknowledge that as chair, it certainly is my prerogative to call the meeting. I did address each steering committee member prior to the meeting. Lastly, this is not unique in all committees.

Nonetheless, Anna, the floor is yours.

[Anna Roberts, Conservative, King—Vaughan, ON]

I think what we have to determine here is the issue that we all face, and that is the importance of how, as the status of women committee, we are going to come together and justify the violence that is occurring in our country. It's out of control. We've heard from different police officers and different chiefs of police. I think we need to get back to the business at hand, and that is on how we can work together so that we can improve the safety of all women everywhere.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Also, I just want acknowledgement. While I was doing my housekeeping, the initial person on the floor was Michelle Ferreri, but I still have some housekeeping that I want to continue before we.... Is there any further discussion on the budget approval before I move forward on the other items that I want to handle?

Go ahead, Marc.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Can you explain what you meant when you said that Michelle was the person?

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Certainly.

When I first started my remarks at the onset of the meeting, I was going through the explanation of the translation and what have you, and Michelle Ferreri did have her hand up. I acknowledged her, but then I went back to the speaking notes and acknowledged to her that I would go back to her. I've allowed some discretion in talking about the budget, and I just wanted to acknowledge that.

If we can deal with the budget, then I want to explain more about where we are with the coercive control study and witnesses and what have you for Wednesday. That would be great.

Go ahead, Leah.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you, Chair.

I'm a little concerned about the process. For budgets, in my experience on committees, we've always worked in a really collegial way to do these things in advance. When it's done after the fact, sitting around the room, I'm constrained to approve something that I wasn't involved in in the first place.

I'm not saying that I have a problem with this budget, but maybe there will be a time when I do have problems with a budget, and I don't want to be put in the position that if I don't approve a budget that's using taxpayer dollars, I look like I'm against an issue. I'm not saying that I'm against this budget; I'm saying that I'm against the process.

I also didn't know that we were at a point in the meeting, when it was called to order, that people were raising hands. Again, I have a concern with the process. We have certainly worked really well as a committee under Karen Vecchio. She always made sure that the committee proceeded in a really respectful manner. Part of it was that she was fierce about process, including with me. I didn't always benefit from process.

I just want to get back to process. You brought up the coercive control study. We're talking about a crisis of violence against women. That's part of that violence. Every time we stall—and going into an election, I'm particularly concerned about process—for folks in my riding, where we have record rates of violence, it means somebody is going to die, and nobody in the House is going to fight for them.

I want make sure that we are good on process, that we follow rules, that we rise above partisan games and that we lift up the human rights and safety of women and diverse-gendered folks in this country, without question, qualification or motive.

That is what I am hoping: that we can get back to the committee process in a good way, because lives are on the line.

Thank you, Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Laila is next.

[Laila Goodridge, Conservative, Fort McMurray—Cold Lake, AB]

Thank you, Chair.

I want to thank you for having me here as a guest today.

With that and the conversation we've had, I'd like to move a motion to approve the budget as presented by the chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Okay.

Do you want to speak to that motion, Marc?

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

I want to clarify, following up on what Leah said.

You said that you acknowledged Ms. Ferreri. Is there anybody else on the list? I just want to clarify before we move on, because the last time there was a lot of confusion on that part, so I just want to make sure that other people are acknowledged.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

I have Laila, Anna and Andréanne.

[Lisa Hepfner, Liberal, Hamilton Mountain, ON]

Wait. I had my hand up at the same time as Michelle. You're not even looking at this side of the room.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

You've acknowledged those three—

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

That's duly noted. I will ensure that it is there.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Can you repeat that, please?

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

I have Laila, Anna and Andréanne.

I'm sorry, Lisa. Where did you...?

[Lisa Hepfner, Liberal, Hamilton Mountain, ON]

I had my hand up at the same time as Michelle. I was sitting here when you opened the meeting, and we both had our had our hands up at the same time, but you did not even look at this side of the room.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

I will add you, at this point, after Andréanne.