Evidence of meeting #129 for Status of Women in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was men.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Emmanuella Lambropoulos Liberal Saint-Laurent, QC
Thank you. I appreciate that.
Madam Trou, go ahead.
Co-responsible of Political Affairs, Regroupement des maisons pour femmes victimes de violence conjugale
Thank you.
In Quebec, for example, the assistance and shelter homes go into primary and secondary schools to offer workshops. I think that, in other provinces and territories, it would be possible to target the specialized resources that are already doing this and provide them with sufficient recurring funding. In Quebec, we're not succeeding in meeting the demand from schools. We know that teachers are already overloaded with many other things in their daily lives. So, I think bringing specialized resources into schools would be a way of offering workshops to young people as early as possible.
Liberal
Emmanuella Lambropoulos Liberal Saint-Laurent, QC
Thank you very much.
Ms. Trou and Ms. Riendeau, you talked about shelters and mentioned that one of the problems was the fact that women can't find affordable housing once they get to the second stage shelters. The government does a lot to build buildings or help convert them. Often, when the government plays a role in this, it requires that about 30% of construction be dedicated to affordable housing.
Do you have any recommendations on, for example, dedicating a certain percentage to women who are victims or survivors of domestic violence?
Co-responsible of Political Affairs, Regroupement des maisons pour femmes victimes de violence conjugale
I think that, beyond setting aside spaces for women who are victims of domestic violence, we need to speed up the delivery of social housing. The problem is access to affordable, safe housing for women. I think that's an important element. Indeed, we can look at how to ensure that women have access to this housing. Already, if there was more of it, that would solve part of the problem, because the waiting lists are very long for access to social housing.
Liberal
Emmanuella Lambropoulos Liberal Saint-Laurent, QC
Right.
I see I have less than 20 seconds left. So I'll yield the rest of my time, and thank all the witnesses for their interventions.
It's very precious to have you [Technical Difficulty—Editor]. I know that it's traumatizing and retraumatizing for some, so we really appreciate you being here.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Shelby Kramp-Neuman
Thank you, Emmanuella.
Next, Andréanne, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.
Bloc
Andréanne Larouche Bloc Shefford, QC
Thank you, Madam Chair.
This testimony is interesting. I had some questions on another subject, but I'll ask them later. Instead, I'm going to continue on the question of housing.
When I visit shelters, it's not the first time I've been told that emergency spaces are unfortunately not being freed up. In fact, women can't get a place in a second stage shelter to be able to get out of the cycle of poverty, and they're afraid of ending up on the street.
Ms. Riendeau, during the pandemic, I had discussions with the Ministry of Public Security in Quebec City. Money had been promised for shelter spaces. Investments had been announced by the federal government for these emergency spaces, and these funds were to be channelled through the Quebec government. But it took another six months to get these funds released. Would you like to say something about the fact that, in the midst of a pandemic, it took another six months for the federal government to release the money to the Quebec government, even though we were living in an emergency situation?
Co-responsible of Political Affairs, Regroupement des maisons pour femmes victimes de violence conjugale
I think we do need to act quickly in such situations. Unfortunately, we see that negotiations between the federal and provincial governments are often long and arduous before services reach the people for whom they are intended.
For my part, I appeal to all parties to really provide these services to women and children and make things easier for them. In situations where a person's safety is at risk, we must act with diligence.
Bloc
Andréanne Larouche Bloc Shefford, QC
Thank you very much, Ms. Riendeau.
Ms. Cooper, you quickly concluded your opening remarks by saying that measures had to be put in place immediately. In less than 30 seconds, what are the most urgent measures that need to be put in place? Would you have one or two measures to recommend to us?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Pauktuutit Inuit Women of Canada
Implement the MMIWG recommendations.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Shelby Kramp-Neuman
Thank you.
Leah, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.
Conservative
NDP
Leah Gazan NDP Winnipeg Centre, MB
Okay.
Understanding that this is a very difficult topic, I wanted to ask you this, Madam Irons, because you shared what happened to your daughter.
The Canadian Women's Foundation stated that “the presence of firearms...is the single greatest risk factor for lethality of domestic violence.”
They also noted:
Rural women are particularly vulnerable to homicide by firearms. Saskatchewan reported the highest rate of firearm-related homicides in 2016, and Alberta experienced the second highest rate. Shotguns and rifles commonly kept in rural homes have been [recorded] as “the weapons of choice” when it comes to domestic violence by the Canadian Association of Police Chiefs. In violent homes, [they] have been used to intimidate and control women...in rural areas.
We've had this ongoing debate in the House of Commons around gun control.
I'm just wondering what your thoughts are about that.
As an Individual
I'm very grateful to the government for the two bills that it has passed, but the concern remains. Bill C-21 is still, of course, in implementation. At a meeting I attended with public safety, I saw that their emphasis right now with that bill is to try to work on all the pieces of the bill concurrently. My point to them was that we had a terrible killing in Sault Ste. Marie last October and that we just had one in Harrow that involved a legal shotgun again. I asked them at that meeting whether, of all the priorities they're working on simultaneously, they could make a greater priority out of the safety of women and children.
I personally am perceiving right now an increase in the number of children whose lives are also being taken with their mother's lives. I'm very concerned about it. It's a myth that legal gun owners don't kill. For example, in terms of femicide, Lépine, of course, at École Polytechnique is the most famous one of all, but there are also Jones, Desmond, Finn, Pearson, Walsh, Soederhuysen and Quesnel. Legal gun owners who committed other crimes include Bissonnette, Lapa, Mercier, Brittain, Schmegelsky and McLeod, Raymond, Fabrikant, Gill, Bourque, and I could go on.
Those bills are very necessary because it's not only criminals who kill. However, in speaking with the RCMP and the national firearms centre, I'm not confident that those bills have been well implemented or that we have any data to show that they have. I don't have a lot of confidence yet that they're actually applying the law as it relates to Bill C-71 for sure.
Conservative
Conservative
Raquel Dancho Conservative Kildonan—St. Paul, MB
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you very much to all the witnesses for being here today.
It was challenging testimony to hear. I know that this committee hears a lot of very difficult topics, heartfelt stories and real traumas. I just would like to thank you for your courage in being here in the first place and in sharing your stories. I think it will have a very lasting impact on members of this committee—certainly speaking for myself.
Thank you very much for your raw testimony. It's deeply helpful to us, as policy-makers, to hear what you've experienced and how you feel that laws should be changed and that funding should be moulded in a way that may prevent deaths of loved ones, such as those in the stories you have shared today.
Ms. Irons, I'm deeply sorry about the loss of your daughter. Thank you for sharing her story. In your opening comments, you mentioned that her killer had not been physically violent but had been otherwise violent: verbally, using coercive control. Is that correct? Where were the shortcomings in legislation that could have provided some sort of roadblock? From what I understand about the way that a lot of intimate partner violence laws are written, someone has to be physically violent to get an electronic monitoring bracelet, for example. Are there other shortcomings? Also, with your knowledge of the laws and as an RCMP officer, can you speak to where those holes are and how the law could have better supported the protection of your daughter from this man?
As an Individual
Well, one change has taken place, although it's not yet implemented. For example, I mentioned my fear, coming out of my policing career, of getting a restraining order in the case of my daughter. Under Bill C-21, there is a new provision in the law that says if an abuser or harasser of a woman—or it could be of a male in some cases—gets a restraining order, the chief firearms officer will be compelled by the court to do a search to see if that person has a licence or any guns, and the guns will be immediately forfeited or turned in. The problem is, as I said, that public safety is still working on all these concurrent priorities. Women may think that this piece has been implemented when, in fact, it's not yet in place.
The red flag laws under Bill C-21 are for a very limited time. They're only for 30 days. They're emergency risk orders, so they're very short. With a restraining order now, once it's implemented, that means that the gun licence suspension and the revocation of the guns will be for the duration of the restraining order, which could be as long as two years.
As I mentioned, my daughter was very reluctant to disclose the suicide threats. She finally did confide in me about one. To my dying day, I will regret that I didn't overrule my daughter, but I told her that we had to either call his parents or call the OPP. At that point, I'd just had it. My daughter was terrified because she said that he'd then get his guns seized—which would have happened—but that he could apply to get them back. He could appeal to get them back after 30 days. Furthermore, he could get an illegal gun anywhere else.
However, as I said before at the public safety committee, in the case of his legal guns that he owned, the law didn't have to make it easy for him to get those.
Conservative
Raquel Dancho Conservative Kildonan—St. Paul, MB
Thank you very much, Ms. Irons.
Ms. Damoff and I worked on Bill C-21, and there was a lot of good discussion around those red and yellow flag laws. I appreciate your feedback on them.
I supported Bill S-205 that recently passed in the House of Commons with quite a bit of support, but one issue of that bill that I found concerning was this. It was a good effort there, but that bill was supposed to provide options to get electronic monitoring bracelets for all the sort of precursors to domestic violence that include, in addition to the physical violence, things like intimidation, break and enters, and things that judges don't necessarily think of as being precursors to domestic violence. Unfortunately, that was gutted from the bill at this committee, so it weakened the stretch of that bill.
Do you feel that those precursors—intimidation, break and enters—should be considered precursors to domestic violence in the eyes of a judge? Also, do you feel that electronic monitoring bracelets should perhaps be put on when something like intimidation is found to be the offence?
Perhaps I'll go to Ms. Tremblay and then briefly to Ms. Irons.
Artist, As an Individual
Absolutely. I regret that this provision was removed from the bill. You know, when we come here to make recommendations, I understand that you discuss them among yourselves afterwards, but you should remember all the research and effort that went into making those recommendations. When we make a recommendation, it's because we're certain we need it.
So, yes, the electronic bracelet should be imposed as soon as there are violent words or gestures, or threats. That way, as soon as someone approaches someone's home to break down their front door, as happened to me, the police can arrive right away.
Earlier, I wanted to tell you that there's also a way for a woman to keep going. That would be to wear a medallion with a panic button that she can press as soon as something happens. That way, the police can intervene immediately. I've worn such a medallion.
So, if you have these two means, the electronic bracelet and the panic button, you have a good chance of getting out of the situation.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Shelby Kramp-Neuman
Thank you.
MP Damoff, you have the floor for five minutes.
Artist, As an Individual
Excuse me. I would like to add something very quickly: The panic button could be offered free of charge to women. When they go to court, they should be entitled to the panic button immediately. I think that would be a good thing. Thank you.
November 4th, 2024 / 12:45 p.m.
Liberal
Pam Damoff Liberal Oakville North—Burlington, ON
Madam Chair, I assume you're restarting my time. Thank you.
I'm really sorry that we lost Lucas. If you're watching or if you watch this later, Lucas, I just want you to know that your sister continues to be the biggest and most colourful flower because of your advocacy. I understand that her heart continues to beat because your family made the choice to donate her organs.
To all of you who have come here to share your stories, I think that you are so brave. I have heard Lindsay's story many times, and she should be here with us right now, as should your sister, Lucas.
I don't know if you know that Keira's law also included a provision for judges to order electronic monitoring of people accused of intimate partner violence. That didn't get as much attention as the judicial education piece. One of the challenges with Keira's law is that it educates federal judges, and we're seeing provincially appointed justices of the peace who don't have legal training, particularly in Ontario.
Maybe I will start with you, Diane and Alison. How important is that education provincially to make sure that police services and provincially appointed judges have education around intimate partner violence and coercive control?