Status of Women Committee on April 29th, 2022

[Shelby Kramp-Neuman, Conservative, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

First of all, thanks to all of the witnesses for all of your time, expertise and opinions.

I'd certainly like to start by suggesting, acknowledging and stressing unequivocally the unacceptability of any of the violations that so many of these individuals are enduring. It's not okay.

That being said, I would like to just make reference to what Ms. Palmater said. Earlier you referenced something particular in your report. It's absolutely correct on the statistics of the report, stating that Canadian mining companies are three times more likely than other countries to engage in violations. However, it's important for me to clarify two points from that particular report. Allow me to read it into the record.

The report is “Corporate Social Responsibility: Movements and Footprints of Canadian Mining and Exploration Firms in the Developing World” done by the Canadian Centre for the Study of Resource Conflict. It states under its “Results and Analysis” section that:

It is important to note that only information on incidents that have attracted significant public attention are captured in this report. Countries where media or civil society groups are negatively controlled by the state or industry will necessarily have less transparency and accountability. As a result, those countries will appear to have limited violations.

Secondly, the report also states, “Considering Canada does have over 75% of the world's mining and exploration company headquarters, it follows that there should be a proportional concentration of CSR violations.”

I just wanted to point that out for the committee.

Moving forward, I'd like to ask a question. I had intended on asking Madame Étienne, but I'll ask either you, Ms. Sirois-Gauthier or Ms. Quinn, if you'd prefer to answer.

The question is more directed to that of progress. Earlier there was a lot of conversation about reports and studies done, but what are we doing to move forward? There was the federal pathway that was brought forward with the intention to support systematic change and address all of the tragedies. My specific question to either one of you is this. Based on your experiences, could either of you speak about the potential effectiveness and/or ineffectiveness of the federal pathway program?

Go ahead, Ms. Quinn.

[Kathleen Quinn]

I would defer to Ms. Sirois-Gauthier, if she would like to speak first.

[Shelby Kramp-Neuman, Conservative, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

Perfect. Thank you.

[Stéfanie Sirois-Gauthier]

Thank you for asking that question. It's very interesting to be talking about the plan that was presented in June 2021.

Remember that the National Inquiry into MMIWG was conducted in 2019. Two years later, we presented a plan, but it was not really implemented. We are hoping for major changes soon.

Even though we at Quebec Native Women have great hopes and are very optimistic about the introduction of desired changes, we have serious doubts. In fact, nothing has yet demonstrated that there have been any concrete changes on the ground.

It's true that considerable amounts of funding have been invested to combat all forms of violence, but there are so many types of violence affecting indigenous women in so many different ways that their impact is not very tangible.

That's what I wanted to say about systemic change. We hope that there will be major changes, but there have been few results so far.

[Shelby Kramp-Neuman, Conservative, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

Excellent. Thank you.

Go ahead, Ms. Quinn.

[Kathleen Quinn]

My apologies, I'm not familiar with the pathway report. However, I would speak to a couple of things.

I'm very proud of our City of Edmonton. They developed an indigenous framework and have been steadily working on that. On April 6 there was a renewed commitment to specifically listening to the voices of indigenous women around what more we need to do in Edmonton as a city—I don't work for the city—to decrease the number of murdered and missing women and improve and lift up the contributions to our community.

Our Alberta government has also made a strong commitment over the last number of years to the family information liaison unit to support the families of murdered and missing women throughout the province and to, again, make renewed commitments through building in indigenous advisory committees every step of the way.

I am also privileged to support the work of the indigenous advisory and monitoring committee for the socio-economic subcommittee of the Trans Mountain pipeline expansion. As I sit and listen to the meetings, I see heavy engagement of communities along that pipeline route, shaping what is happening and identifying the gaps in resources, such as shelters or the need for training. I see those positive developments around me.

[Shelby Kramp-Neuman, Conservative, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

I guess another question....

Am I done?

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Sonia Sidhu]

Yes. Thank you, Shelby.

We will now go to Ms. Kayabaga for six minutes.

Go ahead, Arielle.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Thank you so much, Madam Chair.

I want to take the opportunity to thank the witnesses for being here and for the information they've shared with us.

Ms. Palmater, in your expertise, what are the necessary steps you have identified, or the ones that have been shared with you, that you see would reduce the risk for indigenous women who live near resource extraction sites?

[Dr. Pamela Palmater]

Thank you so much for your question. It's something that we talk about internationally when we compare at the UN and the Inter-American Commission but also amongst women on the ground. I think one of the biggest things is for action to actually be taken on all of the ongoing violence and exploitation.

It's one of those things that happen right in plain sight. You have human trafficking happening at truck stops near the man camps. You have it happening just outside the man camps and sometimes inside the man camps. Everybody knows about it. Police know about it. The managers know about it. It doesn't ever get addressed. There seems to be this barrier to want to address this for indigenous women and girls.

The other thing is to look at what hasn't worked. There have been a million recommendations that say that they just need cultural awareness or gender sensitivity training, but the problem has never been our culture. The problem is violent sexual crimes and violent human trafficking crimes. How do you have zero tolerance for these violent criminal acts that are happening—with the RCMP, corporate actors, state actors or private actors—when there's no follow-up or investigation? There's no real prosecution. They all do it with relative impunity.

I think we really need to look at anything where you can check a box—you know, a community initiative or a donation to a powwow. All of those things should be happening anyway, as partnerships, but the failure to address the ongoing and right out in the open violence that's happening, that's what seems to elude everybody. They want to pick around the edges and not really address the problem.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Budget 2021 did allocate $540.3 million over the course of five years, beginning in 2021-22, and $126.8 million ongoing, to support indigenous communities currently served under the first nations policing program and to expand the program to new indigenous communities.

What do you think have been some of the take-aways for communities who are served by the first nations policing program? What have you heard from that program?

[Dr. Pamela Palmater]

Some of the key concerns are around a lack of jurisdiction and a lack of recognition of first nation laws, whether they be laws created under the Indian Act, such as bylaws, or their own traditional laws. There's a lack of jurisdiction to deal with the predominantly non-native predators who engage in these acts of violence.

Generally, jurisdiction tends to be limited to the reserve boundaries, or, at best, band members, but statistically, the vast number of people who engage in acts of human trafficking, exploitation, murders and disappearances of indigenous women are non-native people. It's the same kind of problem that the tribes have in the U.S. They have court systems, they have laws and they have police officers, but their jurisdiction is limited to on reserve. We know that the majority of the violence happens off reserve by these man camps.

That's going to be an ongoing problem. I'm glad they are providing more money to first nations to have their own policing or safety officers or whatever alternatives they want, but it's the lack of recognition of our laws and jurisdiction that prevents dealing with the majority of the offenders, including the RCMP or people in the military. How can we go against them when they have their own insulated processes?

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Thank you for sharing your comments, Ms. Palmater.

Ms. Doré-Nadeau, ConcertAction Femmes Estrie recently organized a round table called "L'exploitation des minières canadiennes à l'international et ses impacts sur les femmes", about international Canadian mining company operations and their impact on women.

What were the conclusions of this roundtable? Do you think they could be applicable in Canada?

[Viviane Doré-Nadeau]

Yes. One item that came up at the round table discussions was a Canadian mine in Peru that had attacked activists. Our main recommendation was that there be genuine consultation of local populations when mining projects are undertaken. The mining companies ought not to take over the land.

There were also all kinds of violent repression in Argentina. Fourteen activists are in prison now because they opposed mining development. That's why we are asking for a policy that would give an ombudsman the resources required to levy sanctions when Canadian companies cause harm abroad. Sometimes there is fierce violence causing permanent harm, like paralysis or blindness, to some people. Violence like that is totally unacceptable.

We also want our Canadian companies to be much more accountable for their actions when they infringe human rights in other countries.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Thanks. If I could ask you another question…

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Sonia Sidhu]

Thank you, Arielle.

Ms. Larouche, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

I'd like to thank the witnesses for their testimony, to which I listened attentively before leaving to give my speech on Bill C-233, whose purpose is to counter violence between intimate partners. I took the time to listen to you before rushing off to the House of Commons.

I'd like to return briefly to Ms. Étienne's opening address. Given that she had to leave, Ms. Sirois-Gauthier might be able to answer my question.

In her address, Ms. Étienne spoke about the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, which has not yet been signed.

What are the consequences of the fact that this United Nations declaration has still not been signed ?

[Stéfanie Sirois-Gauthier]

When Ms. Étienne spoke about the United Nations Declaration, she was referring to the MMIWG calls to action 13.1 to 13.5, which we also discussed earlier.

The goal of these calls to action is for the welfare and safety of indigenous women to be taken into consideration in the development of mining projects, which is currently not being done, or at least not enough. Indigenous women are entitled to consultation, as provided in Canadian constitutional law and the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples.

Ms. Étienne and I are in New York at the moment to take part in the Permanent Forum on Indigenous Issues. One of the issues being discussed is free and informed consent. The fact is that the absence of consent is blatant. That's the link with the declaration.

What is clear is that mining projects are implemented even if there is no consent. We want to note, however, that Femmes autochtones du Québec is not necessarily against projects that would be beneficial to communities and their residents Technical difficulty economic emancipation. However, such projects have often not been conducted in a way that respects human rights or guarantees the safety and welfare of indigenous women.

Unfortunately, that means women continue to experience all forms of violence, in addition to having their land and resources developed without being consulted and without their consent. With all this is happening right in front of them, it continues to have serious intergenerational impacts, added onto the colonization process and what happened in residential schools.

All of the repercussions we are still experiencing today in terms of mining, forestry and resource development in general are like a wheel going round.

The cycle of all forms of violence never ends. The consequences are felt on many levels and they are neither taken into consideration nor properly assessed.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Thank you very much.

When you say that you're not necessarily against all projects, I take that to mean that you believe it's important to speak nation to nation and establish a better dialogue.

My next question is for Ms. Doré-Nadeau.

You talked a lot about the mining companies this week. I'd like to point out that my colleague from Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot attempted to introduce a motion in the House pertaining to these Canadian mining companies in order to obtain a better overview of their impact abroad. Unfortunately, the motion was defeated.

I'd like to return to this issue because you talked about it earlier and my colleague Ms. Bérubé also asked some questions about it.

Can you give me examples of what extractive companies that operate internationally do elsewhere? Has any progress been made in Quebec on this?

[Viviane Doré-Nadeau]

Unfortunately, at the international level, there is often a great deal of corruption and the police continue to behave violently towards women, as they do here.

Any indigenous opposition to the mining companies is ignored. We are asking for indigenous peoples to be consulted when a mining company begins operating on their land so that the development process can go smoothly. That's not what we are seeing at the moment.

Canada needs stricter legislation for companies. There are, unfortunately, serious shortcomings in this respect. Canada is becoming a paradise for the mining companies because there is so little regulation. It really needs to do something about it.

We also talked at length about changes that were needed from the environmental and sustainable development standpoint. It's important to think about how best to extract primary resources and rare earths.

In our discussions about climate change, we really need to reconsider how we use the land, and our idea of progress, which encourages methods that are really destroying our land. We need to draw inspiration from the methods used by the people of the First Nations to protect their lands.

Thank you.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

I agree with that. Resource development is threatening the environment, and that affects all of us in one way or another.

Madam Chair, I think my speaking time is up.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Sonia Sidhu]

Thank you, Madame Larouche.

We will go to Ms. Leah Gazan for six minutes.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you so much, Chair.

I know that some of the committee have talked about the pathway plan. I've actually put forward an Order Paper question to see what funds have gone out the door from the 2021 allotment, because it seems to me that the government is not responding with the urgency that this current situation demands.

One of the committee members talked about return on investment. I'm arguing that the money hasn't yet been invested, and in fact, zero dollars have been invested in the new budget to deal with the crisis of murdered and missing indigenous women and girls. This isn't a concern just for me. AFN, NWAC and National Family and Survivors Circle have also noted inadequate investment and put forward numbers, to no avail. It's certainly a crisis, and the voices of indigenous women seem to constantly be disregarded.

Madame Sirois-Gauthier, you spoke about the failure to achieve or receive free, prior and informed consent from indigenous women around resource extraction.

In your opinion, why do you think there is such a fear to actually get free, prior and informed consent from indigenous women and girls, who seem to be at the front lines of the most acts of violence? Where is this fear coming from?

[Stéfanie Sirois-Gauthier]

I'm going to change the wording of your question to make sure that I've understood properly.

You want to know why indigenous women are not taken into consideration.

Is that right?

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Yes. For instance, in an extraction project, why is there a consistent failure to receive the free, prior and informed consent of indigenous women, in your opinion?