Status of Women Committee on May 20th, 2022

[Shelby Kramp-Neuman, Conservative, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

Excellent. Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'll start quickly, as I have several questions that I want to address.

First, we know that this government, particularly the Prime Minister, claims to be a feminist government. That being said, in the main estimates, under the government bodies classified or at least named as departments, your department actually has the lowest amount of expenditure, lower than, for example, even the Department of Western Economic Diversification. It doesn't make sense, but I see that programming I would assume, as I think Canadians would, should be under your authority is actually under other departments'. Examples include a contribution under the women entrepreneurship strategy for $61 million to Industry Canada, and the contributions for the women's enterprise initiative of just under $3 million under Western Economic Diversification.

Minister, does the government not have faith in your particular ministry to administer these programs, or is it perhaps that they feel other ministries are better suited to administering them?

More specifically, why is your ministry not being better funded to increase your capacity to administer programs that are relevant to women?

[Marci Ien, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

As I said before, this is an all-of-government approach. We are dealing with women, who make up more than half of our country. What this means is that I work together with my cabinet colleagues, like Minister Miller, like Minister Hajdu, like Minister Hussen, like Minister Anand and so forth. We work together, and we then culminate all that we can.

I support, and our ministry does, in every way GBA+ and other initiatives, but we are talking about women in this country, Shelby, and as pointed out earlier, it's women and housing, women and immigration, women and defence, and women and heritage and cultural issues. This is an all-of-government approach. This is not about something that I am doing alone. We are doing this together.

[Shelby Kramp-Neuman, Conservative, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

Fair enough. Thank you. I'll go to my next question.

Minister, in 2019, the House of Commons Standing Committee on Government Operations and Estimates released a report listing a number of issues with the estimates process. The principle complaint was that the estimates, which are supposed to give parliamentarians a guide to government expenditures, does not include the primary spending measures of that fiscal year—the budget. How are we, as parliamentarians, supposed to do our job if the Treasury Board and Finance Canada are giving us out-of-date information?

Before I finish, I would like to note that I really don't want to hear “waiting for the supplementary estimates”, which is not strong enough. We're supposed to know the day of and not wait until May, when we've already passed the budget. I'm just concerned with some clarity in this particular area.

[Marci Ien, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

Shelby, you might repeat the last part of your question, because I missed it. I'm so sorry. I caught you up until, “I don't want to hear”.

[Shelby Kramp-Neuman, Conservative, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

The main question is how we, as parliamentarians on all sides of the House, are supposed to do our jobs if the Treasury Board and Finance Canada are giving us out-of-date information.

[Marci Ien, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

The President of the Treasury Board, Minister Fortier, and her team are working hand-in-hand with all of us in cabinet to do all that we can in a very timely way. There will be reports and there will be information coming forward in a timely way so that, of course, MPs like you, and those right across the board, across the floor, can do their work.

[Shelby Kramp-Neuman, Conservative, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

Terrific.

Lastly, earlier this year, I filed an Order Paper question asking what percentage of bureaucrats received bonuses, divided up between executives and non-executives. I received the results on May 9 and, quite frankly, I was appalled at the results. In almost every single department, 90%-plus of already overpaid executives received bonuses while the non-executive payout was consistently in the single digits. For example, in your particular department, you paid out bonuses to 94.1% of your executives.

Minister, do you know how many bonuses were issued to your non-executives?

[Marci Ien, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

Thank you so much for the question, Shelby. I will get back to you on that question.

[Shelby Kramp-Neuman, Conservative, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

Okay. Thank you.

I know that you are relatively new as a minister. However, in 2021 your department set out 11 indicators or targets to be achieved, and Treasury Board measures these. Recognizing that you are new, I'm not trying to attack you at all. I'm trying to seek clarity on this. Why is your department failing to meet two of the criteria?

More importantly, why has your department failed to even set guidelines on four of the others? What is the reason for the delay? Is the government not providing you with the tools necessary to do that job? What is it?

[Marci Ien, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

Shelby, thank you again.

I will say that I am new but mighty. I'm not new to lived experience. I am not to new to the 53 years, almost, that I've had on this earth as a Black woman, as a racialized woman. I would point that out.

[Shelby Kramp-Neuman, Conservative, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

Fair enough. We're both new.

[Marci Ien, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

Lived experience is something. We work in a place called the House of Commons, and I stress the “Commons” part.

I would say thank you and I appreciate that you're not trying to attack in any way, but I will say I'm new, but experienced in life, as we all are.

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Thank you, Minister. We're going to have to move on. I'm sorry about that.

We will now go to Sonia Sidhu, who's online with us.

Sonia, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister and officials, for being with us.

Minister, thank you for all of your hard work to advance gender equality across Canada. I agree with your vision. I also liked your statement that you dream of a Canada where every child grows up knowing they can do anything and be exactly who they are. I love that statement.

Minister, we will always defend our women's right to choose. The development in Roe v. Wade shows us why we need to stand up so that everyone in Canada can access safe abortion services. On the $3.5-billion funding announcement that you made last week to strengthen access to abortion in Canada, can you let us know how someone can access these safe services if they need to?

[Marci Ien, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

Thank you so much, Sonia, for the question. It's an important one.

I know that so many women, when we saw the leaked Roe v. Wade.... We're not sure if it's a decision yet, but when we saw that leaked, it took us aback. There are no borders when it comes to that. Women here in Canada felt that pain and marched in our streets. We have to understand that a threat to rights anywhere, including our friends to the south, is a threat to women's rights everywhere.

It is simple for us and our government, Sonia. Individuals alone hold the right to make decisions about their own bodies. Limitations placed on this right are absolutely unacceptable. Access to basic health care is not a matter of debate. Our government is deeply invested in creating an equal and inclusive society that reflects that in terms of maintaining the right to choose.

Our message has been clear from the very beginning. The right to an abortion and access to abortion—access was at the heart of your question—go hand in hand. Every person in our country should have access to safe, equitable and consistent health care services. Through $45 million in sexual and reproductive health, a fund that we have, we're making sure that Canadians facing obstacles in accessing reproductive health care are supported financially.

Organizations on the ground that are providing these essential services, which is what's important here, are provided with vital capacity funding. We are hearing from our stakeholders on what they need. They serve communities whether they are urban, whether they are rural or whether they are indigenous, and they are telling us what's necessary and how they can serve better. We're listening. Our government is deeply invested in creating an equal and inclusive society. That includes continuing, always, to protect the right to choose.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

Thank you for that very important answer.

Minister, you recently visited an organization in Brampton South, Roots Community Services, which provides on-the-ground support to help prevent intimate partner violence, support young leaders and do so much more. They take a culturally sensitive approach.

Can you speak to why it is so important to reduce barriers, especially on the cultural side? Can you expand on that?

[Marci Ien, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

That's an important question, Sonia. Thank you so much for introducing me to that organization and helping me understand exactly what it does.

I am speaking to you as a child of West Indian parents, immigrant parents. The need for a cultural approach to this is something I have seen first-hand. Often, in various cultures, when there is violence, such as intimate partner violence and gender-based violence, the culture dictates that people stay, that women stay, because once you're together you stay. That is a reality right across this country. It is something that I know to be true.

To have culturally appropriate services to highlight specifically what is needed in various communities is important. If a woman is experiencing intimate partner violence and doesn't have anywhere to go, that's a huge problem. If she can go to a centre that she knows speaks directly to her culture, that helps. That can save lives.

I'll add one more thing here, Sonia. I think I said this before, but I will reiterate it. For indigenous culture, during the pandemic, culturally relevant centres—friendship centres—across our country, whose doors were open and that my ministry supported, talked to women who were experiencing violence and were there for them. This saved their lives and helped them, and saved the lives of their children.

Thank you, Madam Chair, for indulging me.

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Thank you so much.

I'm now going to pass the floor over to Andréanne Larouche for six minutes.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

I also thank the minister for joining us today both in the context of our study and to present her department's main estimates.

Ms. Ien, in the 2022–2023 main estimates, your department's budget increased by $73.8 million, to just over $310 million. That is a 30% increase over the previous year.

Do you have a better idea of how that additional $73.8 million will be spent? If you could give us some details, it would help us get a more concrete understanding of how this budget envelope will be spent.

[Marci Ien, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

Thank you so much, Andréanne, for the question.

My mandate with the national action plan has been given half a billion dollars. That is significant. I would also say it's a good start. As the Deputy Prime Minister has pointed out, this is one of four budgets so there are other things to come.

For a specific breakdown, can I ask you to clarify exactly what you want to know?

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

I will put my other questions to you, which may help you clarify how the expenditures are broken down.

In your mandate letter, one of the things the Prime Minister asks you to do is “Create a Menstrual Equity Fund for women's shelters, not-for-profits, charities, community-based organizations and youth-led organizations to make menstrual products available to vulnerable women.”

Does your budget for this year include money for creating that fund? That could be an initiative implemented with the help of the additional $73.8 million. It could be detailed and broken down.

If so, is that not an infringement on the jurisdictions of Quebec and the provinces? The distribution of menstrual products is a health issue, so it may come under the jurisdictions of Quebec and the provinces. Could you transfer the money to Quebec, for instance, unconditionally?

That's an example of a program.

I will then have questions on how the money will be distributed.

[Marci Ien, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

Thank you so much, Andréanne.

You know that we have always worked hand in hand with Quebec when it comes to issues such as these. It is very important that we do. We have had at WAGE long-standing and positive relationships with provincial officials in Quebec. This takes place, as you likely know, bilaterally, as well as through the federal, provincial and territorial forum of ministers responsible for the status of women.

Last August, Canada announced an investment of more than $44 million to Quebec to enhance the assault centres, the women's shelters that I had previously talked about, and other organizations that provide critical services and supports for those experiencing gender-based violence. This was an addition, Andréanne, to the nearly $17.5 million in COVID emergency funding transferred directly to Quebec from Canada in 2020 and 2021, and it supported more than 300 organizations that needed that help. I will be even more particular: It was 347.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

So that money was already transferred. We know that your department funds many programs that promote the protection of individuals. But Quebec has its own measures, its own shelter network, which are connected to health care authorities and social services.

There have already been delays in the payments because conditions were imposed. My understanding is that money was transferred, but was that done unconditionally? Can the Government of Quebec manage the program itself, so as to avoid duplication of efforts? If your department has transferred the money, can it now focus on the provinces that don't have an integrated health and social services system, unlike Quebec, which has its own system to manage that money?

[Marci Ien, Liberal, Toronto Centre, ON]

As you know, Andréanne, it is capacity funding that my department provides—support—and I believe that what you're talking about is very much a provincial jurisdiction.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

So you acknowledge that, when it comes to shelters, money can sometimes be transferred, and that it has worked well with Quebec. As for conditions, there weren't any for those programs. Is that indeed the case? I would like to be sure that I understand, as conditions have been imposed in the past.