Status of Women Committee on Oct. 20th, 2022

[Emmanuella Lambropoulos, Liberal, Saint-Laurent, QC]

All right, thank you.

My first question will go to Debbie.

You mentioned that the biggest issue right now is gender and that people who have a different sexual or gender identity experience a much higher impact on mental health. They have other experiences of mental health. I am wondering if you can give us a day in the life of somebody who works in your shoes.

What is it, exactly, that differs in their experiences? Of course, bullying plays a really big role, as you mentioned. Can you tell us how desperate the need is for us to really take a look at the differences and to fund them appropriately?

[Debbie Owusu-Akyeeah]

Absolutely. That's a great question. Thank you.

In terms of a day in the life—and, of course, I'm contextualizing it for young LGBTQ girls, considering they're the main cohort we work with—for young people to deal with the everyday stressors of their lives, for those who are at a critical period of their development where they are developing a sense of self and are figuring out who they are in terms of their attraction or their gender expression, we know that we still live in a society where homophobia and transphobia exist and that it's still taught in institutions, including within the education field.

Despite the efforts to centre human rights, a lot of that stigma still exists within our communities, so what ends up happening is that, whether it's peer-to-peer, young people weaponize that against their colleagues. A lot of shame still exists for young people, despite seeing other—I'll use Jaime and me as examples—adults who are not that much older than they are who are proud of who they are and their identities. There's still a lot of push-back, and that push-back is driving a lot of issues for these young folks.

Aside from the peer-to-peer model side, I do think it's important to note—and I think Dr. Shanker has mentioned this—that adults play a key role, and sometimes adults are the bullies who are driving these mental health stressors for young folks, whether it's parents who are not affirming, whether it's not seeing yourself reflected in course curricula, or whether it's coordinated approaches and rhetoric to ensure that young trans folks are excluded from doing other things that their peers are doing.

These things still exist. It's cultural. The work that we do is long-term cultural change, trying to centre and normalize the diversity that exists in our communities. What is critical about the work we do is that not only do folks, again, get to see possibility models, but they also get to hear their experiences be centred.

It's not just our work. LGBTQ organizations across the country are doing this. By virtue of existing, they are providing mental health supports and wellness supports in combatting the isolation that those young kids might experience in school by giving them a safe haven outside of a school context, so funding.... I will stress that LGBTQ organizations are super underfunded. We've seen some really exciting commitments recently, but it's not enough, and we need to see this stuff be core and last long.

Our work is super crucial for giving young people a sense of belonging to ensure that the challenges they are dealing with are being met.

Jaime, do you want to add anything?

[Jaime Sadgrove, Manager, Communications and Advocacy, Canadian Centre for Gender and Sexual Diversity]

Yes, sure.

There is one thing I'd add. Debbie mentioned that adults play a role and are sometimes the bullies. I think something that's important to note is the role that service providers play. The work we do is to provide community-focused services, but our staff aren't clinical. That's the case at most 2SLGBTQ+ services.

We know, from the survey included in the 2SLGBTQI+ action plan that was published at the end of this summer, that less than 20% of mental health care providers are providing services that are specific to 2SLGBTQI+. For queer and trans youth, if you're going to get mental health care and the service provider who's supposed to be giving you that care doesn't understand your lived experience or your identity, it's an additional hurdle where you're having to educate this person who's supposed to be giving you care. Especially if you're a youth who carries compounding identities—maybe you're from a racialized community, or you're Black or indigenous—that's a real challenge and a real barrier to accessing mental health care.

[Emmanuella Lambropoulos, Liberal, Saint-Laurent, QC]

Thank you.

I guess, Jaime, you just helped us lead to my next question. I know that Debbie also mentioned knowledge mobilization so that adults know how to respond to our youth. Do you have any recommendations as to how we can make that knowledge mobilization happen? What are some of the ways that we can educate educators so that they're better aware of certain issues when they're dealing with kids from so many different backgrounds, in every sense of the word?

[Jaime Sadgrove]

Yes, absolutely.

We actually have a program that started earlier this year called “Not Just The Tip”. It's funded by Health Canada and it's a pilot project for a “train the trainer” model for comprehensive sex education. Essentially, our staff are going to go to cities in Canada and train sexual health educators in how to provide queer- and trans-inclusive sexual health education. I think a model like that could be really effective in terms of educating health care providers and teachers on how to provide compassionate and informed services to queer and trans youth.

It's something that's scalable as well. Rather than having to have staff all over the country, having people who can go to train trainers, who can then provide those services and pay it forward, I think is something that would be scalable in a really meaningful way.

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Perfect. Thank you so much.

We're now going to pass the floor over to Andréanne.

Andréanne, you have six minutes.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'd like to thank the witnesses for being with us.

It's interesting to talk about cross-identity factors with Mr. Sadgrove and Ms. Owusu-Akyeeah and Ms. Omeniho, and violence with Mrs. McMillan, Ms. McLaren and Dr. Shanker. It's interesting to hear the different concerns around mental health.

Ms. Couture, you made a heartfelt plea. For the reasons you mentioned, you work from home, and you are the mother of a young girl with mental health issues.

Over the course of this study, we've heard from several witnesses about the importance of stable and adequate funding for organizations such as yours, which work on the ground and are on the front lines of helping people with a variety of mental health issues.

Do you think that the unanimously requested increase in federal health transfers to Quebec and the other provinces and territories could be one solution? You mentioned a lack of financial resources.

[Véronique Couture]

Yes, that could be a solution. However, funding must be provided quickly and on a recurring and consistent basis.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

That's precisely what health transfers do. The federal government would commit to stable, recurring, predictable and significantly increased transfers. You want this kind of recurring and stable funding.

The federal government is increasingly interfering in Quebec's jurisdictions. It sets up project-based programs, which isn't what organizations like yours are asking for. Stable, recurring funding is provided by the Quebec and provincial governments, which have the necessary skills and are much closer to what is happening on the ground.

Can the imposition of conditions and the project-based approach lead to duplication of services? Wouldn't it be better to transfer the money to Quebec's ministry of health and social services, which could then distribute it to organizations such as yours through its support program for community organizations?

[Véronique Couture]

Yes, in Quebec, the funds should be redistributed through this program. It needs to be simple and easy to access, so that we don't have to hire someone or ask someone to be dedicated only to this task. Project-based funding complicates things. We want the funds to support the overall mission of the organization or group receiving the funds.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

You've been in the community and on the ground for a long time, and you've been saying this for several years. So you're well aware of the programs that are already available to you from the Government of Quebec. You discuss this with them, and they wait to receive funds to finance several projects.

The federal government talks about imposing conditions on health transfers. Yet it's the department that has the expertise, and you're working with them now, right?

[Véronique Couture]

That's right, with the Quebec ministry of health and social services.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Specialized organizations like yours are being told that the ministry is waiting for funding, is that correct?

[Véronique Couture]

Yes. Right now, we're working off of an agreement that is from 2015, and the funds aren't coming in. We're receiving negligible increases.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

You also mentioned bureaucratic overload. What do you think of the idea of another level of government setting conditions and standards?

[Véronique Couture]

It would require doing the same work twice. We want to simplify the work, only have to do it once, and receive our funding. Project-based funding, on the other hand, requires a lot of ad hoc work that requires us to do the same thing again and again.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

I'll move on to something else.

You said that you were seeing an increase in mental health issues on the ground. Could you tell us more about that?

[Véronique Couture]

Yes, absolutely.

These problems have been exacerbated since the pandemic began. Right now, there are 38 people in need on my waiting list. I can't help them because I don't have enough case workers or rooms, and because I can't afford to hire more case workers or expand the space.

Our case workers give really a lot for very little.

Our organization has never had a waiting list, actually. The list has been growing for about a year and a half. People live on the street or end up in prison for committing crimes. That happens a lot.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Do you—

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Thank you so much. We're at our time. We'll be sure to get back to you, Andréanne.

I'm now going to turn it back online to Leah.

Leah, you have six minutes.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you so much.

Thank you to all the witnesses.

I'm joining you from unceded Algonquin territory, but from home today, which is new.

My first question is for Debbie or Jaime.

I want to ask you about the mental health of a particular segment of the 2SLGBTQIA+ community: the trans community. We know that trans youth face a much higher risk and higher rates of mental crises than other youth. For example, from the Ontario chapter of the Canadian Mental Health Association, we know that LGBTQ youth face 14 times the risk of suicide—you indicated suicide rates before—and substance abuse of heterosexual peers, and from an Ontario-based study, we know that 77% of trans youth who responded to that study had seriously considered suicide and 45% had attempted suicide. It also found that trans youth and those who had experienced physical or sexual assault were found to be at the greatest risk.

I mean, to share that these statistics are not alarming or upsetting is a complete understatement and, clearly, is indicative of a failure to respond to people of diverse identities and experiences. I think it also demonstrates that we are not properly supporting 2SLGBTQIA+ youth and, in particular, trans and gender-diverse youth.

Can you expand on what more we need to do to support queer and trans young people? I know you spoke about disaggregated data. I certainly agree with you. Just on the ground, if we could turn the key tomorrow, what would some of those supports look like?

[Jaime Sadgrove]

I can start, and then I'll pass it to Debbie.

I think the disaggregated data, which you mentioned, is one of the most important things. We just don't have information on a federal level about where the need is for trans and gender-diverse communities. For example, the 2019 health standing committee report on LGBTQIA2 health has data specifically on the experiences of LGB people, but there are no axes of analysis about how that breaks out when compared to gender identity. While you're right, Ms. Gazan, that research has been done on provincial levels, we haven't had that data on a federal level yet.

The training for service providers is another big piece, and building on what some of other witnesses have said, I think funding is a really big part of it. Most of the organizations across the country that provide services to LGBTQIA+ people are funded on a project basis, so there's no ability to grow that kind of core capacity.

When you're thinking about marginalized communities, the clinical support is a really important aspect. The other piece is being able to connect with people who share your experience. When you think about pride centres or queer and trans community centres, they're really providing life-saving support. I think, especially in rural areas or more remote areas or in provinces that don't have big cities and that have municipally funded pride centres, that funding is a really core need.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

I'm going to have to move on to my next question just because I have a limited amount of time. I'll ask this one of Debbie, because I know that she is leaving in the next hour.

We know that LGBTQ rates of becoming unsheltered or of homelessness are much higher. I know the government isn't doing enough to address this, especially the many youth who are often kicked out of their houses or abandoned by family after coming out. To your knowledge, what kinds of supports do you know of that are currently effective?

My second part just brings up some statistics. For example, according to Stats Canada, prior to the pandemic, LGBTQ2+ Canadians—at 27%—were twice as likely as their non-LGBTQ2+ counterparts—at 13%—to have experienced some kind of homelessness or housing insecurity in their lifetime. We know this is a crisis. I know it's a crisis, certainly, for many young people in my riding. What programs available right now, that you know of, are effective, and how are programs that are currently available not meeting the needs?

I'll give that to Debbie.

[Debbie Owusu-Akyeeah]

That's a great question. I think it's twofold.

There are the existing shelter services, which have a long way to go in being affirming of LGBTQ people. That is a huge gap that we're continuing to see. I have a history of working within the women's shelter sector myself, and I know that there are still some ongoing challenges in building capacity to ensure that those spaces are safe for not only queer people but also, I would say, transgender folks in particular.

I have more research on this and actually a study that I helped contribute to, which I'd gladly share later on so that folks can access that. There's definitely that support work. I actually think the LGBTQ sector and the shelter sector can be doing a lot of work together to address that.

Second, I would say that, with regard to family violence prevention, there is a lot of work that needs to happen in working with parents and caregivers around preventative work to support their young people so that these young folks are not ending up on the street. More work on that would be really crucial—and funding that, as well.

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Excellent. Thank you so much.

We're now going to start our second round. It's five minutes for the Conservatives and the Liberals, and two and a half minutes for the Bloc and the NDP. I'm going to turn over the first five minutes to Dominique Vien.

Dominique, go ahead.