Evidence of meeting #94 for Status of Women in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was program.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:40 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Karen Vecchio
Thank you very much.
We're now going to pass it over for our second round.
Anna, you have the floor for five minutes.
11:40 a.m.
Conservative
Anna Roberts Conservative King—Vaughan, ON
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Welcome back, Karen. It's nice to have you back.
Jamie, thank you so much for sharing your background and being so open about it. I think more and more people have to realize that we might have disabilities or issues, but they can be overcome with strength. You've obviously proven that. Congrats.
I remember that, in junior high, we had what was called a home economics department and an industrial arts department. In the middle of the year, we switched. The home economics classes, which were 100% female, and the industrial arts classes, which were 100% male, switched. We learned the basics while the guys learned the basics, as well. Let's be honest. When you move out and go to university, you have to learn how to cook for yourself.
One thing I found very interesting was this: At the end of that semester—this was in grade 8, so we were still quite young—there was a project assigned to us. At the end of the year, everybody was graded on who did the best. It may have been for a clock—I can't remember—but a girl won it. She won the contest over the guys. The interesting part was that a boy won the cooking competition. We were, like, “Oh, my God.”
How do we as a society stop that stigmatizing? I'll be honest with you. My brother and I cook a lot together, and he's a much better cook than I am. How do we stop this? I don't think the provinces have incorporated that old system. They say, “We have to move on.” Yes, we have to move on, but it's something that worked way back then.
Would you advise the provinces to say, “Hey, we should start this program again, to incentivize not just women but also men”?
11:45 a.m.
Founder, Made in the Trades
Yes. I think the curriculum system needs to change, and there are compulsory credits that should be looked at. Everybody should do home ec. Everybody should have some understanding of psychology, healthy boundaries and empathy. I also believe everybody should know the basics of fixing their own vehicle and maintaining their own home. Construction and automotive should be compulsory credits.
I believe these credits should be integrated with people, no matter how they identify, because, at the end of the day, careers don't have genders. We're the ones who do that. We're the ones who make the genders.
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
Anna Roberts Conservative King—Vaughan, ON
I know our party is pushing for a blue seal program for professionals.
I live in an area where there's a lack of construction employees, and they are retiring. You're right. They're retiring because, depending on their job type, their retirement age is much younger than 65. Obviously, it takes a toll on your body, which I'm sure you can explain to us. I also know that, for example, a lot of roofers from other provinces come to Ontario to work during the summer months—from Newfoundland or wherever—because we have a lack of them.
How is it that, with all the outflow of retirees...? Do you think we're at a point at which it is crucial we get working on this ASAP?
11:45 a.m.
Founder, Made in the Trades
Absolutely. There is a serious lack of people to fill the labour shortage gap right now. There is a lot of opportunity. We have failing infrastructure that needs to be strengthened. We have factories that need to be built. We have an increasing population and not enough people to build these homes. Yes, construction should be at the forefront of everything we're talking about right now. Getting people into construction careers should be promoted, the same way we promote college and university.
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
Anna Roberts Conservative King—Vaughan, ON
One of the things I like is the co-op program. This is a stupid idea, maybe, but I'm going to throw it out there. If we had a co-op program in high schools, whereby—and I know there are insurance issues or whatever—even in high school, individuals who are interested in the trades could do a co-op program now, instead of waiting until they go into construction courses and colleges, do you not think that would entice more young people to take advantage of it?
11:45 a.m.
Founder, Made in the Trades
We do have those programs. Through the Ontario youth apprenticeship program—and I'm pretty sure they have programs like this across Canada—students can enter skilled trades as soon as grades 11 and 12. It's up to 400 co-op hours towards their apprenticeship. Some of those are paid co-ops.
The problem is that we don't have enough co-op opportunities for students. I also think employers need more incentive to give co-op opportunities.
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Karen Vecchio
Thank you so much.
We're now going online to Sonia Sidhu.
Sonia, you have the floor for five minutes.
February 6th, 2024 / 11:45 a.m.
Liberal
Sonia Sidhu Liberal Brampton South, ON
Thank you, Madam Chair. It's great to see you back.
Thank you to all the witnesses.
My first question is for Ms. Campbell. It's about the women entrepreneurship strategy ecosystem fund and the work of your organization helping first-time women and gender-diverse entrepreneurs.
What recommendation can you give this committee about helping first-time women entrepreneurs when they are starting their very first business or company?
11:45 a.m.
Senior Director, Community Initiatives, Canadian Women's Foundation
The women entrepreneurship strategy is really incredible. It has supported a number of women and gender-diverse people on their trajectories to starting, scaling and growing their own businesses.
For those who are just getting started as entrepreneurs, one of the biggest issues is access to financing, access to capital. If they are uninitiated in financial jargon, it is very intimidating to approach a bank with their business idea and then be met with the notion that their business idea is too risky or that they don't have enough collateral to be able to pursue their business idea without any kinds of extra supports in place to help them be ready to access that kind of financing. That's really discouraging.
A lot of women and gender-diverse folks who are self-employed are doing this as sort of microenterprises. They are solopreneurs. They are working on the thing that drives them and is their passion. They're trying to sell these things. It's not necessarily able to sustain them and their families, but there is growth potential there, so it needs to be nurtured and supported and incubated. That's what the women entrepreneurship strategy is helping to provide, that holistic approach to supporting these people in getting their businesses going and accessing the capital they need.
11:50 a.m.
Liberal
Sonia Sidhu Liberal Brampton South, ON
Thank you. My next question is for Ms. McMillan.
Last month I had the chance to announce more than $2 million on behalf of the Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Official Languages towards a network of colleges, including Sheridan College in my riding, together with Unifor's $300,000 contribution for women in Red Seal trades programs. It was exciting to see many like-minded leaders working towards increasing women's participation and retention, which you were talking about earlier.
Can you speak to this committee about the importance of working side by side with unions and educational institutions to increase women's participation in the skilled trades?
11:50 a.m.
Founder, Made in the Trades
That's a loaded question. I can say a lot on the subject, and I'm trying to think how to approach this.
With unions and colleges, they have two different paths. When someone goes through a college career, they're paying to go to school, usually up front, and they're continuing their apprenticeship after, so they're looking for an employer to sponsor them for their apprenticeship once they've completed college. I always think that college is a good pathway for people who are academic. It will help them learn and climb up the corporate ladder quickly, and that is a good way to approach it.
For somebody who goes directly out of school into a unionized apprenticeship, they are not getting as much of the theory side, but they're getting hands on. That's where you get a lot of people in skilled trades that are very similar to people like me, who are hands-on learners. We struggle academically. Those are the people you would probably want to recruit and recognize would be good candidates to be in those skilled trades apprenticeship pathways.
For women, or for any under-represented group or any group at all, it's crucial that we promote these pathways more and let people understand the difference between the college pathway and the union pathway.
I think it's important we all get along and understand that these are all the choice of the person and that people have the right to choose what they want to do. Whether we want to go to college or work union or non-union, we're all entitled to work in a career that makes us happy and take it the way we want it to take it.
11:50 a.m.
Liberal
Sonia Sidhu Liberal Brampton South, ON
Ms. Campbell, my next question is for you, on the women entrepreneurship knowledge hub.
Can you share your best practices with this committee, what you have learned from running this program to support women and gender-diverse entrepreneurs? My question has a data perspective too—how to collect data.
11:50 a.m.
Senior Director, Community Initiatives, Canadian Women's Foundation
I'll just clarify that the women entrepreneurship knowledge hub is not our initiative. It is under the women entrepreneurship strategy, but it is an amazing hub for data and knowledge generation. If you're looking for thought leadership on what's happening for Black, indigenous and racialized entrepreneurs in Canada who are women and gender-diverse, that's the place to look.
We have our own research that will be disseminated there as well.
11:50 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Karen Vecchio
Thank you so much.
We're now going on to our two and a half minutes. I'll pass the floor over to Andréanne Larouche.
You have two and a half minutes, Andréanne.
11:50 a.m.
Bloc
Andréanne Larouche Bloc Shefford, QC
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Ms. Morrison, I'll focus on what struck a chord with me in your presentation. You spoke of a worrying trend involving the decline in the number of women in positions of influence.
You said that burnout, but also mental load, could be contributing to the decline in the number of women in the workforce.
How could the federal government help ease this mental load for women? I'm thinking of a day for invisible work, for example. How can we collectively take steps to better recognize invisible work? How could this affect the number of women in positions of influence?
11:55 a.m.
Director of Operations and Communications, The Prosperity Project
I think, once again, that child care is central to this issue. Ensuring that women are able to care for their families and have a professional career is very important.
I also think the government has a role to play in setting the example for other sectors in the economy. Women have reported—and this comes out in our “Canadian Households' Perspectives” report—that they feel supported with hybrid work environments with some flexibility and deliverables-based performance evaluations. Implementing those sorts of initiatives within the public sector and the government would set an example. It would show how well women react to those sorts of things. It would allow for the demonstration of increased retention rates and increased job satisfaction.
There is a lot to play in terms of being a trendsetter, I think.
11:55 a.m.
Director of Operations and Communications, The Prosperity Project
The outright return to the workplace, I think, is a bit too heavy-handed. It should be considered more logically and more with a view to when it actually benefits the workplace to be in the workplace, as opposed to times when it might be more beneficial to all to do things in a remote way.
11:55 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Karen Vecchio
Perfect. Thank you so much.
We're now going to move over for our last questions from Leah Gazan.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Leah Gazan NDP Winnipeg Centre, MB
Thank you.
Thanks to the great witnesses today. I've really enjoyed this committee.
I want to go back to inclusive environments and women feeling a sense of belonging. I see a really concerning trend in this country. There's a direct attack on bodily autonomy, whether it's reproductive rights or gender diversity, in real time now being filtered in the House of Commons.
It's concerning for me how it could potentially move us backward in supporting inclusive work environments and things that women—my mother and gender-diverse folks—have certainly fought for.
What do we need to do as parliamentarians—you spoke about modelling—in our own work environment to support inclusive work environments on the ground?
I'll ask you, Caitlin Morrison. Thank you.
11:55 a.m.
Director of Operations and Communications, The Prosperity Project
Sure. That's a wonderful question.
I think that often, when we see a movement toward beneficial societal change, when we see a move toward DEI initiatives like we saw in 2020 and the years thereafter, there can sometimes be a backlash from that, a sort of move to undo the change that has been done. I think that we're seeing that in a lot of ways in conversations about DEI and the effectiveness of DEI.
11:55 a.m.
Director of Operations and Communications, The Prosperity Project
I'm sorry. It's diversity, equity and inclusion initiatives.
We, as an organization, think that there's evidence to suggest that these initiatives are actually working. Rather than pull back from these initiatives, talk about their failures and demonize anybody who has benefited from them, we believe that now is the time to assess what has been done correctly where inclusion has been well established in organizations, in the government and in the private sector, and to move to improve what we're doing—to double down on diversity, equity and inclusion, if you will, and improve its capacity to make Canada a more inclusive country.
Noon
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Karen Vecchio
Thank you so much.
On behalf of the committee, I would really like to thank Caitlin, Jamie and Karen, who have come for our first panel.
We are going to suspend. We have some audio checks to do, so we'll get back as soon as the audio checks are done.
Thank you very much. We are suspended.