Evidence of meeting #42 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was preuss.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
I have no idea what other people perceive what I say to mean. This was frankly an administrative action on my part. I had no other intention.
Being somewhat experienced with how it works around here and the consternation in the minds of people who are thrust into committee settings like this, I was quite concerned about my employees, frankly. It had nothing to do with what they say. And it would be totally against what I'm trying to do here in terms of an open society.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
The initial impression, I think, that this committee was allowed to infer—and I hesitate to say encouraged to infer, but it certainly came from the implication of the language used—is that the words that you would “have an issue with it” are rather menacing language for those who are associated with communicating impartial information to this committee.
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
Again, I can't speak for other people's impressions. I can only speak to what my intentions in that wording were, if in fact that is the wording I used. As I said, to me it was an administrative conversation. I frankly don't even remember the day it happened. I know the period of time it happened in, but it wasn't something that—
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
No, I don't remember, because as I said, it's quite a few weeks in the past, and it was an administrative question. I was not anticipating that my words would appear before a committee such as this one.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
So you would be surprised—is that what I should draw from that, that you would be surprised—that you would have used language like that?
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
No, I didn't say that. What I say is that I don't recall what language I used. I don't recall being in any way concerned with the telephone call. It was administrative in nature, simply trying to ascertain what the situation was going to be with the association.
I knew full well that if the committee here were talking to or asking individuals to appear, I'd be notified through another process. In this particular—
Liberal
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
No, he's not. He's the head of the bargaining unit for the pilot inspectors in civil aviation and elsewhere.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
Why would he even think to appear and to have any Transport Canada employees appear with him?
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
I have no idea. And again, I wasn't told, nor did I assume that this was the only source of requests for appearances before this committee.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
But the normal procedure for any Transport officials, who are employees, to appear before a committee would be to clear through the vertical chain of command in your department, wouldn't it be?
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
I'm not sure; that's a committee question. I think what happens is that you make an invitation as a committee, but as to the process, I'm not aware of the details.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
No, but you have a parliamentary directorate that indicates who should appear before the committee, to ensure that you have individuals with the appropriate information for distribution.
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
Oh yes, but rarely, if ever, does that reach down into the working levels of the organization. It's people of my responsibility area who appear before this committee. Rarely is it inspectors. As soon as I heard the word “inspectors” here, I said, that's a little interesting.
And of course the context is that this is after there have been reports of surveys presented to this committee, so I'd--
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
But are members of that inspectorate part of the Transport Canada human resources structure? In other words, are they employees of Transport Canada?
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
Who's this, again?
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
The members of the inspectorate that Captain Holbrook has with him; do they work for Transport Canada?
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
Do you mean the people in his office?
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
I think the support he gathers from the membership is, in a lot of cases, that of Transport Canada employees. The board that directs his actions is made up of Transport Canada employees, yes.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
Is it correct to say that a question like the one you would have posed would actually have referred to any employees who perform inspecting functions?
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
The only people he would know about or be qualified to respond about would be pilot inspectors, because those are the members of his association.
Director General, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
I was directly referring to pilot inspectors appearing, to his knowledge, with him or without him; it was never a question of solely just appearing with him.
