Evidence of meeting #55 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 39th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was sms.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
With regard to the inspections or whatever else you carry out.
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
That's right.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
You will carry out either more or fewer inspections, depending on the level of risk.
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
Yes, that is normal procedure.
In addition, some operations are so fine-tuned and their people are such experts that it is easier for us to provide them with some extra monitoring. We are always ready to intervene.
Furthermore, amendments have been moved to strengthen the powers—I should say that the powers have always been there—in terms of perception, to make it clear that despite designated organization status, the minister is still responsible for approving regulations and standards. You will see, as we come to those amendments later on. This was done to strengthen that provision.
Now, I know that we were talking about an implementation in three years' time, but since it will take between two and three years to craft the regulations, we would have liked it to occur sooner. Moreover, if the members of associations such as the Canadian Business Aviation Association were designated, that would allow them to appear before a tribunal. At present, they do not have any recourse. Therefore, if ever the association refused to recognize them for whatever reason, they would have no recourse.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
Except that these are the same people who told us that the inspectors are doing other things. That is what concerns me. I was coming to that. You have been working for a long time with the members of that association, carriers and private jet owners. Those people came to tell us that the inspectors were doing other things. They said that we would see, that they would deal with security. But there are more and more private jet owners.
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
Yes.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
I also like that you struck the word "scheduled" before the words "air transportation," because those people do carry passengers.
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
We removed the word.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
Clearly, they will pay to carry passengers, but we are concerned because we do not want there to be a back-door market without any oversight.
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
The word has been removed, Mr. Labramboise.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
I understand that, but your friends seem to be forcing your hand somewhat.
What we want is—
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
Canada is the only country in the world that requires that an association monitor those people. Elsewhere, there are no regulations except for the basic ones.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
But other countries surely have inspectors to check whether those people comply—
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
No.
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
No.
Elsewhere, Mr. Laframboise, things are just like for private aviation. For example, if I own a private plane, if I have my own plane, inspectors can no doubt come inspect it from time to time, just like in any other sector, but in other countries, including the United States, small business jets are not as regulated as they are here in Canada.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
That must be why people were able to attend jet pilot courses and then fly into the World Trade Center Towers. That is why I am concerned by these things. Do you understand?
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
That is a whole different issue.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
What I mean to say is that that is how those people are trained to become private jet pilots. That is the situation and that is why I would prefer that you and your inspectors continue to monitor those people. I want to make myself clear: the service should be maintained. That is also why we want the coming into effect in three years. You should perhaps be pleased by the three-year period: that will give you the time needed to make the association understand that this is serious business. This is not only about their having to contend with fewer inspectors. They will continue to deal with them, but in the meantime we will regulate them and ensure that the organization operates in accordance with Canadian laws. Perhaps with stronger legislation, all pilots will be duly accredited.
Between you and me, what do you make of all this?
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
Mr. Laframboise, I think that pilot training is another matter. I do not think that this has anything to do with it.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
Nevertheless, they have to practice and receive training somewhere. To do this, they often use private jets. Do you know anyone who owns a private jet?
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
Yes.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
An investigation can take up to two years to find out who owns a jet. You have to deal with general partnerships that have several owners.
Director, Regulatory Services, Civil Aviation, Department of Transport
However, Transport Canada has a good registration system for aircraft owners. But, as a matter of fact, there are company names—
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
—that are more complicated than others. This is why I am a bit worried about this issue and I really want to make sure that we can trace those people.