Transport Committee on March 8th, 2011

[Yaprak Baltacioglu]

I'm not exactly sure when it's due to be finished. It shouldn't be--

[Laureen Kinney, Associate Assistant Deputy Minister, Safety and Security Group, Department of Transport]

I don't think there was a set date.

[Yaprak Baltacioglu]

We'll get you an update.

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

Good enough. Okay.

[Yaprak Baltacioglu]

But it's under active consideration and discussion.

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

There are two other items, if I have some time. On the electric car regulations, I've seen that the electric car manufacturers are concerned that there's been very slow progress in getting these regulations in place. We're falling behind the rest of the world in terms of moving on this. What's the status, from your perspective, with the department?

[Yaprak Baltacioglu]

Some of the programs that we had in place, like eco-technology, actually looked at exactly the connection between testing these vehicles and the connection to the regulatory rule making. Actually, while I understand that everybody feels that we have not been that fast in terms of tackling this particular technology, the department has been doing a lot of work around this, but we're not at the gazetting stage yet, so I wouldn't say this year.

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

Not this year?

[Yaprak Baltacioglu]

I don't think they're scheduled for this year.

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

We're getting a lot of complaints about the new commercial regulations that go down to canoes. Is there any sense that this regulation can be brought for review? Is there any hope that we could see some modifications to this particular regulation?

[Yaprak Baltacioglu]

Mr. Chairman, what the honourable member is asking about is exactly what our minister has requested us to do. One was first to clarify the application of these regulations. Transport Canada's mandate, and the federal government jurisdiction over waters, requires that we do make sure that companies that are actively engaged in commercial activity in renting canoes or kayaks, etc., do provide the public with the necessary safety issues. But of course this ended up being generalized to things like girl scouts and boy scouts, and that definitely is not the objective of the legislation. So we clarified that.

The minister also asked us to do a very in-depth look at this issue, including if regulatory changes or legislative changes are necessary. He asked us to look at it. We are working on it very hard and that shall be done.

[The Chair, Conservative, Merv Tweed]

Thank you.

Mr. Jean.

[Brian Jean, Conservative, Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you, witnesses, for appearing today. My question is very simple, and then I'm going to pass the floor to Mr. Watson.

My question has to do with exactly what was brought forward by Mr. Byrne, and that is we have in front of us a motion. In fact, Mr. Byrne had a question on the Order Paper and Notice Paper for March 2 as well in relation to the same.... It has 20 bullet points on this particular notice of motion that Mr. Byrne wants to move. I'll just give an example of one of those. He's asking for:

All reports, minutes of meetings or record of meetings held either between the President, the CEO or the Board of Directors or any Committee of the Board of Directors with either the Minister of State (Transport), and/or the Minister of Transportation, Infrastructure and Communities held between January 1, 2004 and March 1, 2011;

It goes on with quite a list of other documents that they're requesting.

My question is very simple. I would ask for a written response from the department as to how long it would take to get documents like this in the future. In his motion he's asking that you reply within seven days. From my perspective, as a lawyer for 10 years, to get that much paperwork in seven days, you might as well take all 8,000 employees and do nothing but look for that paperwork.

My question to you is--and I want it in writing, please, if you don't mind--how long would it normally take for a response of this type? I know it has to go through a lawyer for privacy. It has to go through the department. I would say 10 or 15 people have to go through each and every one of these documents. How long would it normally take to be reasonable for you and your staff? Quite frankly, I don't think it's reasonable to expect that kind of mountain of paperwork in seven days.

I don't need the response now because I know Mr. Watson has quite a few questions, but I would like, if we could, to have just the process it goes through, and then what would be normal for a one-page document that's fairly simple, to something like this, which in my mind would take two or three years. But if I could have that as a response to the clerk, I'd really appreciate it, because we do have several motions that are coming in front of us that are of a similar nature. I would like to make sure, and I'm sure all parties would like to make sure, that we don't put your staff under undue hardship and late hours.

Saying that, I will pass the floor over to Mr. Watson.

[Yaprak Baltacioglu]

Will do, Mr. Chairman.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

While I have the floor, if you don't mind, I'd like to raise a point of order.

[The Chair, Conservative, Merv Tweed]

Mr. Watson has a point of order.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Yes, it relates to the orders of the day at hand. I know Mr. McCallum has made a request for time. I note that it's not on the orders of the day. Would that require unanimous consent of the committee to change the orders of the day?

[The Chair, Conservative, Merv Tweed]

It's not a point of order. And no, it does not have to be on the paper.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Okay. I just wanted to be clear about the process for that, Mr. Chair. Thank you very much.

Thank you, of course, to our witnesses for appearing today.

In the minister's opening comments he referenced the estimates and the Detroit River international crossing as a line item in the estimates. He used the terminology that this was frozen spending or that it was unlocking some frozen spending. Could you clarify that for me? What does the expenditure relate to, and why was it frozen in the first place? What is it being applied to?

[André Morency, Assistant Deputy Minister, Corporate Management and Crown Corporation Governance, Corporate Services, Department of Transport]

Traditionally, when the appropriations are given to the department, there are certain funds that are what they call frozen, in a frozen allotment, to the extent that they are only to be used for those purposes and to the extent that we haven't been able to use that, because, as you know, the DRIC project has not advanced to the extent that it could. We were able to access those frozen funds to be able to do that one-line expenditure of $1 million.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Okay. Thank you for the explanation.

With respect to the DRIC, is there any indication of when Michigan intends to bring forth any legislation? Has there been any discussion about that legislation to create the entity, if you will, that would participate in the public-private partnership? Is there any update on that?

[Yaprak Baltacioglu]

Well, given that this is a top priority item for our country, and given the amount of support that has been given to the project already, we're waiting for the legislation to be tabled. I can't really tell you exactly when the Michigan legislature is going to consider that. Hopefully that vote is successful. I would say we would move to the next step, the public-private partnership arrangements around that.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

I presume as well, as in past practice, that Transport officials would be prepared to testify, if necessary, in front of legislative representatives in Michigan.

[Yaprak Baltacioglu]

We're prepared to do almost anything.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Thank you.

I will move on to rail safety. There's been discussion around the recommendation to have a non-punitive reporting system within the safety management system. We have had witnesses who have appeared and who have suggested there should be a direct line to Transport Canada instead. I think there was some discussion about Securitas. I'm not sure if it can be both a direct line to Transport Canada and a non-punitive reporting system within an SMS. That's just my personal suspicion. Workers would be inclined to use one versus the other.

I'd like your thoughts on that, first of all. Secondly, with respect to Securitas, could you explain briefly—and I know the public are also watching—whether Securitas is adaptable to a non-punitive reporting system, in your opinion? What can you tell us about that?