Evidence of meeting #31 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 41st Parliament, 2nd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was aviation.
A recording is available from Parliament.
National President, Union of Canadian Transportation Employees
I can provide it through the chair or through the clerk after, but I believe somebody might have info on that.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Larry Miller
Mr. Chalmers has his hand up. It's up to you. It's your five minutes.
National President, Union of Canadian Transportation Employees
Thank you.
President, Pacific Airworthiness Consulting Inc.
Thank you, Chair.
Companies are getting what's called a program validation inspection. Now, inspections can be anything from an airplane inspection to an inspection of a personnel licence. What they're doing now is a program validation inspection that is a portion of the SMS program, so all small companies, the non-705 companies, are no longer receiving audits, no longer receiving the standard oversight. What they're getting now is this program validation inspection that goes in and looks at their internal audits to see how their internal audits are doing, essentially the same as what the SMS is.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Larry Miller
Sorry, Mr. Toet, you're out of time.
We do have bells going. Just for our witnesses, we have an emergency vote coming up.
Mr. Komarnicki, you have the last five minutes.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I'm looking at notes prepared by the Library of Parliament. They're talking about air carriers that carry more than 20 passengers and so on. They said that SMS regulations for these companies were introduced in 2005, and compliance is not required until 2008. If, as you say, traditional inspections stopped in 2004, would it be fair to say that it had nothing to do with the SMS system, given what I have just indicated to you?
Ms. Collins.
National President, Union of Canadian Transportation Employees
I understand that starting from 2004 it was a transition, so they were starting to do the SMS audits.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
You're saying the SMS regulations were then implemented in 2004.
National President, Union of Canadian Transportation Employees
I didn't say that. I'm saying the SMS-style audits started in 2004, and SMS was slowly being implemented starting in 2004.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
I am looking at an access to information request by the member for Trinity—Spadina, Olivia Chow, and Transport Canada's response. The question was:
With regard to air safety: (a) how many inspections were done each year from 2004 to 2011, broken down by (i) audits, (ii) traditional inspections, (iii) process validation inspections....
In the response breakdown, it said that in 2010-11 it has the number of audits as 198; traditional inspections, 13,684; and process validation inspections, 905.
Are you, Ms. Collins, taking issue with that response by Transport Canada?
National President, Union of Canadian Transportation Employees
I guess it would be the definition that is problematic for us. What we're saying is that what they're calling “traditional inspections” includes SMS inspections or the audits.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
Your differentiation is, you're saying, that their way of defining traditional audits is not something that actually involves on-site inspection without notice.
National President, Union of Canadian Transportation Employees
That's correct.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
I'm looking at your recommendation for reforms, executive summary. You say safety management systems are “an additional layer of safety”, so you agree that a properly instituted and implemented safety management system is a good thing. Is that correct?
National President, Union of Canadian Transportation Employees
Absolutely.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
You're on record as supporting the concept of safety management systems and their application to the Canadian transportation industry.
National President, Union of Canadian Transportation Employees
Absolutely, as an additional layer.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
You would say that it is important insofar as it brings a safety culture and safety accountability to transportation companies, employees, and management.
National President, Union of Canadian Transportation Employees
Absolutely.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
It becomes really a question, in large measure, of implementation and maturation. Would you agree with me on that?
National President, Union of Canadian Transportation Employees
No, I'm not sure what you mean by that.
Conservative
Ed Komarnicki Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
Implementation is a big part of the maturation of the system, correct?
National President, Union of Canadian Transportation Employees
No, I don't totally agree with that. I don't believe it should ever be a replacement for the role of the Transport Canada inspectors.
