Transport Committee on May 28th, 2019

[Todd Doherty, Conservative, Cariboo—Prince George, BC]

Again, Ms. Ferland, I'm asking.... Perhaps I'm not being clear enough. Does the department, when entering these agreements with first nations, set out the guidelines? Is there a guideline or a time frame, a horizon or window where the first nation cannot apply for more operational funding for that project? Is it the expectation that they have built the capacity over two, three, five, 10 years so they now have the capacity and the wherewithal to manage the project and the facility themselves?

[Chad Westmacott]

Thank you for the question.

If I understand correctly, let's be clear. There's a difference between the capacity to run the facility and to deliver the infrastructure, to manage a project, to actually—

[Todd Doherty, Conservative, Cariboo—Prince George, BC]

Managing the operations and a project and the capacity, building that up, is all part and parcel of this.

[Chad Westmacott]

Right. We are working with the first nations to build up those capacities to be able to do so—

[Todd Doherty, Conservative, Cariboo—Prince George, BC]

But is there a responsibility placed on them by the department?

[Chad Westmacott]

There are responsibilities. They are the owners and they are the operators of that infrastructure, and they are responsible to make sure that infrastructure works appropriately. We support them—

[Todd Doherty, Conservative, Cariboo—Prince George, BC]

Are they ever denied funding?

[Chad Westmacott]

As we've already mentioned, the demand exceeds the available funding, so yes, there are first nations that do not have access to funding given the priorities.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Make it a short question, Mr. Martel.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Okay.

Good morning.

I know that the government is committed to investing a great deal of money in infrastructure. Of that amount, how much money has your department contributed to date? Is it possible to know this?

[Claudia Ferland]

Thank you for the question.

To date, $2.72 billion has been invested in the construction of 3,797 projects.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you, Mr. Martel.

We'll go to Mr. Aubin.

[Robert Aubin, NDP, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'd like to talk briefly about the troubling situation in the Cat Lake community. Do you know the extent of the mould-infested houses issue and the costs involved in addressing it? Is there a crisis plan specifically for this community? If so, what's the time frame?

[Chad Westmacott]

Thank you very much for the question.

I don't have that data available, but I can get it for you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Ms. Ludwig, you have a question, and Mr. Badawey, if it's short.

[Karen Ludwig, Liberal, New Brunswick Southwest, NB]

Thank you.

Ms. Ferland, we look at the north and we base it on science. We see that it's warming at three times the global rate. When you're looking at the priorities for first nations and working with the different first nations communities, do you have a long-term plan for the remote communities in the north that may have issues with access when the roads are no longer frozen?

[Claudia Ferland]

Thank you for the question.

When we do an infrastructure project—I'll use Manitoba as an example—we take into consideration the construction season. We actually do take into consideration the winter roads and access. We're currently working on a project very closely with four first nations. It's called the Manitoba schools initiative. We're building four schools in northern Manitoba. The access to bring up the materials can only be done in the winter. There's no airport. There's nothing. When we build the project, the entire project plan with the first nation is actually taking into consideration the northern road, the ice roads, the availability of resources, and also when people can go to school to take training. With the Manitoba schools initiative, over the period of, I think, January to March, almost 1,100 trucks brought all the materials. Now that we're ready, we started the build on April 1 with the first nation.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Mr. Badawey.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I want to go to the sustainable funding subject that Mr. Doherty and a few others were embarking on.

Obviously, territories and reserves are very limited in where their revenue can come from. Taxation, water and waste-water rates that a municipality would otherwise accrue over time, they don't have that ability to accrue because they don't tax, or there's no water and waste-water rates, I'm assuming. Therefore, being limited, are there opportunities to ensure that the investments that we make as government actually give them returns, especially economic returns? I think this was where Mr. Doherty was going with respect to accountability and sustainability. New assessment, mining rights, pipelines, and so on and so forth.... Are these investments going to lend themselves to those projects so that they eventually become more economically and socially self-sustainable, as well as with regard to lifestyle?

He punted it back to you, Claudia.

[Claudia Ferland]

The situation is interesting. We do work with first nations on a regular basis.

I'll use Alberta as an example. As we're working with some of the oil-producing first nations or some first nations that want to do tourism industry work, some first nations that want to export and import broadband want to become involved in the connectivity field.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Let me jump in.

With that said, is there also opportunity to create more jurisdictional clusters, not just including reserves but also including the outside groups that they can partner with? It could be a municipality, it could be the province, but jurisdictionally, let's face it: It's one province, one country. Is there an opportunity for those partnerships as well?

[Claudia Ferland]

In working with the Assembly of First Nations but also other indigenous organizations such as the Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs or the Chiefs of Ontario, we try to find what the synergies and opportunities are. Respecting the nation-to-nation relationship, however, there may be opportunities to work with tribal councils; there may be national indigenous organizations. Some of our first nations work very closely with the municipality they are located in as well.

There are a number of bundling experiences, then. It's not a “one size fits all”. It really is what the need of the community is. What do they want to achieve and how can we work to develop a community capacity development plan that is reflective of their needs from a nation-to-nation perspective?

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

The expectation, then, would be that all of those investments would lend themselves to returns that would in fact make them more self-sustainable.

[Chad Westmacott]

Let me just add something.

One thing is that the basic infrastructure in any community allows opportunities for economic growth going forward. If you don't have clean water in a community, it is pretty hard to have other economic activities occur. The basic infrastructure being provided through the gas tax funding and other funding that we have can support other economic opportunities within the community.