Transport Committee on March 31st, 2022

[Melissa Lantsman, Conservative, Thornhill, ON]

Does anybody else want to opine on that? I think we're going down an interesting path here.

[Steve Pratte]

I can make a quick comment.

Certainly in our sector, the western Canadian grain sector, we've seen billions of dollars in investment from grain exporting and handling companies in-country with the redevelopment and the new building of the best technology for grain collection. We've seen billions of dollars in the last decade at port, specifically Vancouver, as far as getting the grain out of the export terminals into the boats. On both ends of that, there are contractual relationships with daily charges that go both ways for contract breaches and time penalties.

We do give credit. The railways have a tough job. We have a tough geography in which to operate. We have long distances to move that grain from within the country to the export position. Certainly, the shippers of grain products in western Canada would like to see some tightened contractual relationships with the railways and the ability to have more robust reciprocal penalties.

That's been talked about by this committee and in various pieces of legislation since about 2009, but that's still something we'd like to see as a sector, tightening up the—

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Mr. Pratte.

Thank you very much, Ms. Lantsman.

Mr. Chahal, you have the floor for five minutes.

[George Chahal, Liberal, Calgary Skyview, AB]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you to all of you for your testimony today. I'm going to begin with Mr. Lemaire.

You talked a bit about reforming shipping legislation, like what they are doing in the U.S. Could you talk a bit more on that and what lessons we can learn, whether it's from that specific legislation or any other examples?

[Ron Lemaire]

I'll just reference some recent information from the U.S., looking at some of the key pieces coming out of the House of Representatives bill. The introduction of the ocean shipping antitrust enforcement act is one key piece trying to deal with the oligarchy of shipping lines that are in the market, totally controlling channel routes and container movement. It is a challenge for a Canadian jurisdiction, and even a large entity like the U.S.

The other side is looking at how to understand the actual... The U.S. is looking at the consideration of its ocean shipping reform act. When we look at Canada and the Canada Transportation Act, we look at how we can leverage it to ensure we have shipping lines and the broader transportation system more effectively supported. We heard Mr. Pratte mention a few key pieces around rail, on dispute resolution and some other key elements. We need to take it as a whole and start looking at the regulatory levers we can effectively adjust and put in place to basically enable businesses that aren't in a position to negotiate with the power to effectively compete in domestic and global markets.

[George Chahal, Liberal, Calgary Skyview, AB]

Thank you for that.

Mr. Buhagiar, I have a question for you.

You talked about needing a national strategy and a North American strategy. I'm wondering if you could provide any insights on interprovincial barriers that are making our supply chains less efficient, and if you have any ideas of areas in which we can improve on that.

[Christian Buhagiar]

Mr. Chair, through you to the member, thanks for the question. It's an important one.

I'm not sure if today I have specific examples, but I'll follow up with some to the committee. I do want to make a general observation, though. Supply chains don't have political borders. They don't see geography in that sense, so there are.... During the pandemic there were lots of examples of provinces putting certain restrictions in place on the transportation sector, which meant that when somebody crossed the border, all of a sudden they had different rules. We have some of that today with respect to the type of information that provinces want, particularly in trucking, as people go through provinces.

It's a challenge, and that's why for me a national strategy with all levels of government...and let me be clear that the municipalities play a role in that. The federal government could have the most incredible transportation strategy, even working with provinces, and it could break down in a municipality. When Toronto—I'm going to pick on Toronto today because I'm from the GTA—places certain rules on transportation within its streets, that breaks down the chain again.

Ron and I have spoken passionately about this before. A whole-of-government approach, which is a whole-of-governments—plural—approach is really what is key if we're going to have a supply chain in Canada that is the best in the world.

[George Chahal, Liberal, Calgary Skyview, AB]

I'm glad you mentioned that, and to add on that, there's a lot of talk about challenges at our ports and about modernization. What are the opportunities for growth particularly in western Canada—we know what's happening in Vancouver and Prince Rupert—with growth for inland ports in Edmonton and Calgary? My riding has the Calgary International Airport. We have two rail lines that come into our city.

What are the opportunities for inland ports and what do we have to do in western Canada to make sure that centres like Calgary, Edmonton and Regina can also flourish with growth and opportunities for inland ports?

[Christian Buhagiar]

Mr. Chair, through you to the member, that's a perfect question. We talk mostly about our sea ports, but our inland ports are critical. I'd be remiss if I didn't mention, in the centre of our country, CentrePort in Manitoba, which is another great example.

The simple answer is that we need to invest more. We need more inland logistics ports, and it isn't just a western issue. I appreciate your perspective on the west, but it is an issue that we need to address all over Canada. Inland ports are a critical piece of the overall infrastructure we have to look at and invest in.

[George Chahal, Liberal, Calgary Skyview, AB]

Chair, I think my time is up. I'd like to ask more if I have more time, but....

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

It is, unfortunately, Mr. Chahal. I'd like to thank you and I'd like to thank, on behalf of the entire committee, all of our witnesses for being here today and for providing their expertise and time to us on this very important study for all Canadians.

I'd invite you all to now log off and I kindly request that my colleagues remain online for some very important housekeeping that I've been asked by the clerk to engage in.

Thank you very much, again, witnesses.

Colleagues, I know that especially some of you who take flights have made very clear that you'd like to leave as quickly as possible after 5:30. We started a little late today, so I apologize for that. We were waiting for members to get back into the committee room.

The clerk has asked me to take care of some housekeeping today, which will take one minute, if you'll permit me, and it's regarding two study budgets that we need to approve quickly.

Mr. Clerk, I will turn it over to you for perhaps a minute to explain exactly what we need to be doing, and then we'll have a quick vote.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Mr. Michael MacPherson]

Actually we just need someone to—

I see Marilyn.

[Marilyn Gladu, Conservative, Sarnia—Lambton, ON]

I move to approve both of the budgets as presented.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

That was quick. That's why we miss you, Marilyn.

(Motion agreed to)

Thank you very much to all members for the great meeting we just had. I wish you all a wonderful weekend.

This meeting is now adjourned.