Transport Committee on June 13th, 2024

[Serge Bijimine]

I, personally, am not aware, but someone on my team may be.

[Vincent Millette]

There are initiatives in some regions, such as the Atlantic provinces, where a group has been set up to find solutions to their regional connectivity problems. It had consultants do studies and has issued a request for proposals to attract regional air carriers.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much.

Thank you, Mr. Barsalou‑Duval.

Next, we have Mr. Bachrach.

Mr. Bachrach, the floor is yours for two and a half minutes.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Bijimine, we've heard some statements made by airlines about air passenger protection regulations, so I'll ask some questions on that front.

My questions are more about how the regulations treat passengers who make complaints. As you know, this is a long-standing concern of ours.

Recently, we heard stories from passengers who are no longer being told by the CTA where they stand in the queue. At one point, when you made a complaint, the CTA would tell you that you were complaint number 20,337 or 60,592, or whatever your spot was in the queue. That's no longer happening.

Are you aware of this?

[Serge Bijimine]

I am not aware of it.

This is under the purview of the Canadian Transportation Agency. They are responsible for receiving the complaints and for managing and adjudicating those complaints, so I feel the question would be better answered by my colleagues at the Canadian Transportation Agency.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

I guess this is the difficulty. The CTA also has a connection to Transport Canada, and we have certainly asked Transport Canada other questions about air passenger protection regulations. The minister is ultimately responsible for these regulations, because he wrote them, with the help of your department, and the regulations are not serving passengers.

I just talked to a fellow the other evening. He made a complaint, went through the lengthy complaint process and came out the other end. The CTA actually awarded compensation in his favour. Air Canada had until April to pay the compensation, and they still haven't paid. That was as of this week.

What is the government doing to ensure that the airlines actually pay the compensation that they are ordered to?

[Serge Bijimine]

In full transparency, the complaint process is a challenge, and there are a lot of challenges around the complaint process.

I believe my colleagues at the Canadian Transportation Agency have been working around the clock to try to make improvements, but more improvements are needed.

However, I definitely would prefer to not step in their zone and on their turf and what they do and how they operate. I would really prefer the question to be answered by the committee.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you. Thank you very much, Mr. Bachrach.

Next we have Mr. Muys.

Mr. Muys, the floor is yours. You have five minutes, sir.

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

You indicated pilot shortages, mechanic shortages and a number of shortages that are problematic, particularly in northern and remote circumstances. During the pandemic and following the pandemic, there was an incredible backlog in getting medicals for pilots. In fact, we have heard about pilot schools that had to close down. I certainly had a number of constituents call my office where we were trying to get those medicals.

Has that been remedied? If so, what lessons have been learned? I mean, it's an unacceptable delay. It's an unforced error. How do we fix this?

[Andy Cook]

Thank you for the question.

This is a great opportunity to set the record straight. There isn't actually a backlog of files for medicals; there is a queue of complex medical cases.

Right now the regulations require that medically fit pilots have their medical applications processed within 40 business days. That happens in almost every single case. I think it's important to underscore that 75% of pilots who are going to civil aviation medical examiners or doctors to have their medicals reviewed are processed on the spot in the doctor's office.

The ab initio applications for new pilots have to come through our headquarters, and all pilot applications who are fit are processed within the 40-business-day standard.

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

Is that just recently, or has that been the case? I reject your analysis, because that's certainly not what I have heard.

[Andy Cook]

It is not a recent trend. What you referred to as a backlog is a queue of approximately 5,000 to 6,000 files that are awaiting processing, but those files are driven by the complexity of the medical cases.

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

Would you not suggest that 5,000 to 6,000 is a large number? I mean, it's almost as bad as APPR.

[Andy Cook]

It is a large number, but it's important to put that number in context. Those cases are complex medical cases that would otherwise not meet the medical standards. These are pilots who could otherwise be considered unfit but for whom the minister is trying to exercise discretion to get those pilots flying. Often that requires medical diagnostic tests for which there are intersections with provincial health queues, and so on and so forth, and intersections with specialists who have to assess them.

That complex case queue is a number of cases on which the minister is trying to exercise discretion to get those pilots flying, but it takes time.

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

Okay. Thank you.

What is Transport Canada doing in terms of the high cost of flight training for aspiring pilots? I have certainly talked to some who are in flight school in my constituency, and I know others have too, and there's a burden.

Are there any initiatives under way to help alleviate that? That's an impediment to the pilot shortage.

[Andy Cook]

Thanks for the question. I can take that one as well.

Through you, Mr. Chair, we are working extensively in civil aviation. Although our mandate is mostly aviation safety, we're working with stakeholders to try to come up with solutions that can be mutually beneficial.

You're right that there is a very high cost to obtaining an airline transport pilot licence in Canada. It takes many years, because there's a sequence of licences that have to be gone through first, and experience needs to be acquired.

I can say that some airlines in Canada—I don't want to name any specific operators—are working on what is called a cadet program to partner with training institutions in provinces, and that offers a lot of promise. It is a challenge, and we are very willing to work with stakeholders and partners to try to address the issue.

[Serge Bijimine]

I'd like to add a little bit to what Andy just said.

According to our current research, the demand for pilots in Canada is around 2,500 each year. We're potentially looking at a shortfall of close to 10,000 pilots by the end of this decade. The studies and the cost of the studies has been mentioned as a roadblock, and we totally understand that.

We have begun work with partners in other departments—ESDC, for instance, and IRCC—as well as with provinces and territories, which do receive federal funding for training. We're looking at different ways and trying to work with provinces to make some of this pilot training eligible for their provincially run—

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

Let me cut you off so I can get one more question in.

[Serge Bijimine]

—pilot training program.

[Dan Muys, Conservative, Flamborough—Glanbrook, ON]

Then there's slow progress.

Flight duty regulations are an impediment to operating in the north and remote areas, which adds some challenges. Is Transport Canada doing anything to address those?

[Andy Cook]

We are looking at the flight duty regulations, but it is important to underscore that the flight duty regulations that were promulgated, announced in 2018, and implemented in 2020 and 2022 are designed to make pilots less fatigued in flight. Fatigue is an impairment. I've personally flown on long missions, and anything that can reduce the amount of time a pilot spends in the cockpit makes a pilot safer.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Mr. Muys.

Thank you, Mr. Cook.

Next and finally, for our first round, we have Mr. Rogers.

Mr. Rogers, the floor is yours. You have five minutes, sir.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Thanks, Chair.

Chair, before I pose questions to our panellists today, I would like to move a motion that I put on notice on June 6. I'll read it into the record:

That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), the committee undertake a study examining the value of regional development agencies in Canada and their impact to the quality of life in Canadian cities and communities; that the committee invite witnesses with specific knowledge of the work of the regional development agencies; that the committee allocate a minimum of seven meetings to this study; that the committee report its findings to the House; and that pursuant to Standing Order 109, the government table a comprehensive response.

Mr. Chair, if I could speak to that motion, first I want to say that the importance of the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency in Atlantic Canada is immense. I was astonished to learn that John Williamson, a Conservative colleague, said, and I quote, “no Atlantic MP is prepared to make the tough but necessary case that regional development agencies hurt the development of local economies in the long run.”

Not only did Mr. Williamson write this, but Conservatives last December repeatedly attempted to cut RDA funding to reduce funding of almost every RDA program to $25,000. Now, Mr. Chair, that to me is astonishing and appalling. When I think about the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency, which was established back in 1987, and the amount of work it's done in the Atlantic provinces, I could speak to this for hours.

I certainly can speak about Newfoundland and Labrador and what it's meant. When this agency was introduced, it was done because there was a very difficult and sluggish economy in Atlantic Canada. Things were really tough. This organization has achieved immense benefit, brought immense benefit to Atlantic Canada, and the other RDAs that have been structured since are really modelled after what the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency has done and achieved.

When I think about economic value and the important part that it brings to the life of small businesses and communities in rural Atlantic Canada, I could talk about the Burin Peninsula, for example, and the amount of work and the dollars that have gone in there to establish Grieg's sea farms as a major employer and contributor to the economy. I could talk about the Bonavista Peninsula and the work it's done for providing support to establish a UNESCO geopark designation that is supporting 25 communities and driving tourism in a very positive direction. I could talk about the money and the funding and support it's provided to municipalities in Newfoundland and Labrador, many of them very small places that depend heavily on ACOA, as we commonly reference that organization, and the kind of work that it supports for small towns in rural Newfoundland and Labrador and rural Atlantic Canada. We could talk about the provincial organizations like the Newfoundland and Labrador Snowmobile Federation, which is a major winter tourism driver, or talk about Hospitality Newfoundland and Labrador, a major tourism organization, and we can also talk about the positive impact it's had for the fishing industry and other industries in terms of export trade and the kinds of things that are happening.

Mr. Chair, I wanted to introduce this motion and suggest that we do a very comprehensive study to point out the value of this organization in Atlantic Canada and the other RDAs across the country. It's not just about ACOA; it's about the seven regional development agencies across the country, albeit some of them are practically new, like the one in B.C., for example, or some of the ones in western Canada.

Nevertheless, the study would be an opportunity to inform and remind Conservatives of the work done by these RDAs, which I credit with changing the economy in Atlantic Canada since 1987.

Mr. Chair, I'll leave it there.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Mr. Rogers.

I have on the list right now Dr. Lewis, Mr. Badawey and Mr. Muys.

I see your hand up, Mr. Strahl. Is that to speak, sir? Perfect. Okay.

We'll turn the floor over to Dr. Lewis.

[Leslyn Lewis, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Through you, Chair. I'm concerned about the relevance of this particular study to this committee. Mr. Rogers spoke about the connections between fishing, export and trade, issues that really could be better studied within another committee.

I'm also concerned about the particularities of the nature and scope of the motion. The term “value” is so vaguely described that I don't see the connection to this committee per se.

Also, there are vast regional differences among different regions. When you look at the regional development agencies, you see the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency, Canada Economic Development for Quebec Regions, the Canadian Northern Economic Development Agency, the Federal Economic Development Agency for Southern Ontario, the Federal Economic Development Agency for Northern Ontario, Prairies Economic Development Canada and then Pacific Economic Development Canada. I've listed seven agencies. The motion is calling for a minimum of seven meetings.

Given the comprehensive nature of these different regional development agencies, many of which are dealing with issues that are not even related to this committee, I would submit that this motion has been brought improperly before this committee. It's the wrong committee. The depths that would be required in order to explore the vague definition of “value” across these various agencies would probably take up our entire year of study within this committee.

Those are my submissions.