Transport Committee on Aug. 19th, 2022

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Like—

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Bachrach.

Next, for the second round, we have Mr. Barrett for five minutes.

Mr. Barrett, the floor is yours.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Minister, if there was no scientific basis for mandates, as has been indicated by officials, why would your government institute a policy that infringed on Canadians' rights, that didn't have scientific basis, and then call a snap election a couple of days later?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Do you mean the non-scientific mandates that were implemented by municipal governments? Do you mean the non-scientific mandates that were implemented by provincial governments? Do you mean the non-scientific mandates implemented by the private sector without requirements from government? Do you mean the non-scientific mandates that were implemented by universities? Do you mean the non-scientific mandates that were—

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Minister, I'm talking about the mandates implemented by the federal government at airports—

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

—implemented by governments around the world?

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

I'd like to quote one of your officials in court documents that were reported on by Rupa Subramanya. One of those officials is on the call today. Let me quote from an email: “To the extent that updated data exists or that there is clearer evidence of the safety benefit of vaccination on the users or other stakeholders of the transportation system, it would be helpful to assist Transport Canada supporting its measures”. That's a quote from ADM McCrorie.

Now, the mandates were set to be implemented, but your department didn't even have the information that indicated it was necessary or based in science.

To just circle back to your question about the science that's being followed by municipalities and provinces, they have all eliminated their mandates since, yet you have not. If you're following the same science they are, why have they all lifted their mandates but you have not?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Mr. Chair, let me start out by saying that vaccines have proven to have saved lives and continue to save lives. At a moment in time when our public health system is under a lot of pressure, vaccines continue to be an incredible tool in saving lives and protecting the health and safety of Canadians and our health care system.

The federal government has suspended most of our mandates. The only mandate we have is at our borders, as in many countries around the world. It is done to ensure that we minimize the importation of the virus and to protect the health and safety of Canadians.

Let me point out to my honourable colleague—on top of all the studies that have been done over the last two years—two different studies, just in the last two months. One was done by the Canadian Medical Association. One was done by the University of British Columbia, which demonstrated that these public health measures, including mandates, protect health and safety and have saved upwards of 60,000 lives and prevented the importation of the virus tenfold at our borders.

There is ample evidence that I'm happy to table with the committee that provides justification for these vaccines.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Thanks very much. We look forward to your tabling that information.

Over 60 countries around the world have abandoned all of their air travel pandemic restrictions, including most of our European allies. PHAC's internal reports suggest that air travel had almost no impact on COVID community spread—less than 1%—so it is questionable why those would still be in place.

Minister, you're talking about science. The CDC in the United States, with whom we share a border, says that it makes the most sense not to differentiate between the vaccinated and the unvaccinated and that sub-jurisdictions don't need to start making mandates.

Minister, let's talk about the mandates you still have in place. What are the current regulations for air and train travel in Canada with respect to COVID-19?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Mr. Chair, there are still many countries around the world that require proof of vaccination for international travel—

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

I asked about your mandates, Minister. I have less than a minute.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Second, currently, the Canadian government has suspended our vaccine mandate for our transportation sector, so there is no requirement for domestic or international travel for people who are leaving the country, whether they want to get on a plane or a train.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Minister, do you have to wear a mask on the train or the plane, and if someone does not, what should be the consequence for that person?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Currently, we maintain a mask-wearing policy for federally regulated air or train sectors. It is scientifically proven that masks reduce transmission upwards of 80%. We're doing everything we can to protect the health and safety of Canadians, and it is the prudent thing. In fact, it's the kind thing to do—

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Ten seconds, please, Minister....

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

—to protect those sitting next to you.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Minister, your Prime Minister was seen not wearing a mask on a train just mere weeks ago. Was that not prudent or kind of the Prime Minister?

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you. You can follow up on that question in the next round, Mr. Barrett, or perhaps one of your colleagues can.

Thank you, Mr. Barrett. Thank you, Minister.

Next we have Mr. Iacono.

Mr. Iacono, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Good day, colleagues.

Good day, Minister. I'm glad to see that the COVID symptoms have not been too harsh with you. I guess you are fully vaccinated, and it shows.

Travelling post-COVID is like time travel. You really don't know what to expect. We will probably be able to write a postpandemic manual soon, but it sure doesn't exist yet. Is that right, Minister?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Thank you very much, Mr. Iacono, for your question and well wishes.

Indeed, when COVID arrived, it did not arrive with an instruction manual. Governments around the world grappled with doing everything they could to protect the health and safety of their citizens.

We are now going through a different phase of the pandemic as we are restarting our economy and certainly witnessing unprecedented phenomena. We need to, first of all, do everything we can to focus on addressing congestion causes and other types of disruption to minimize the impact on our citizens and our economy.

I also think it's an opportunity for us to learn from this phase that we're going through. There will be a time to look back and write a manual, as you call it, Mr. Iacono, so that we can learn from what we went through and make sure we improve our systems for the future.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you, Minister.

What steps were taken to prepare for the anticipated return of traveller volumes.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Iacono.

First of all, let me just say that during COVID, when, as I explained, 90% of customers in the aviation sector disappeared, we did everything we could to ensure that we maintained a resilient sector. We made sure that we provided access to wage subsidies so that employers could retain as many of their employees as possible. We provided financial supports to airports. We provided financial supports to airlines. We provided rent deferrals and infrastructure funding to help airports prepare and to help airlines remain resilient during an unprecedented time.

Then, as we were planning for the restart, we ensured that we worked with government agencies like CBSA, CATSA and others, and the CTA, to prepare them for what we predicted would be an increase in demand. As everyone knows today, the surge in demand far exceeded many predictions, but we did everything we could to prepare for it. We are seeing that the private sector, the public sector and all the sectors of our economy have been grappling with this restart, with the surge in demand, and we've been working on ensuring that the labour shortage we're experiencing is addressed as quickly as possible.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you, Minister.

Why did Pearson and Pierre-Elliott-Trudeau airports in particular do such a poor job with flight delays in July?

Have we seen any signs of improvement since then?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Indeed, Monsieur Iacono, we've been seeing significant signs of improvement. I highlighted some of them in my opening remarks.

Having said that, first of all, we're seeing delays across the world, but Canada is somewhat unique in the fact that the hole that the airline sector and the aviation sector are coming out of was deeper than in many other countries. I gave the example that Canada's increase in travel between January and August was 252%, compared with the 63% we saw in the United States. While Canadian airports and airlines have gone through experiences of labour shortages that are similar to those around the world, the hole that they were coming out of was deeper. Therefore, the acceleration out of it was faster, and we saw significant delays.

There's now evidence that we are moving in the right direction. Credit goes to those who work in the airports, airlines and governing agencies who have been working really hard at addressing these causes.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you, Minister.

The problems at airports often seem to occur at peak hours. What is being done to avoid the large number of arrivals and departures occurring at the same time?