Transport Committee on Oct. 3rd, 2022

[John Gradek]

I'm not sure if wage growth.... The world of service industry today is highly competitive. When you have Amazon, as an example, paying people $23 an hour as a starting salary to work in an Amazon warehouse just off the end of the runway at Pearson, and Air Canada is hiring people at $18 an hour, there's a problem going on in this process. Can regulation fix that? Probably not.

The marketplace is the way in which you have to recognize what the dynamics are of the hiring that you're doing and the wages you're paying. Unfortunately, aviation wages are now second fiddle to some of the other organizations hanging around airports.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Mr. Lawford, did you want to comment on any of those questions?

[John Lawford]

Yes. I do believe the labour shortage issue does have something to do with the working conditions and the pay at airports. That has been a long slide. When things were going well.... The labour unions have complained that they got zero per cent increases all this time, when times were good, and now they have very low wages and they can't bring people back. That's part of it.

Whether the minister should have been a little more aggressive.... I know he has a hard job, but there has to be more oversight and planning in the department, from my point of view. Consumers really had an awful time this summer and really felt like someone needed to be taking charge. Whether it was possible to solve all the problems, I don't know, but a little more public showing that the minister was taking charge probably would have helped a bit.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Mr. Lawford and Mr. Rogers.

This concludes the witness testimony for the first hour of today.

I'd like to thank our witnesses, Mr. Gradek and Mr. Lawford.

I also want to thank Mr. Charbonneau, who appeared virtually.

Thank you all for being with us today.

We will suspend for two minutes, and then reconvene for the second hour.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

We will now resume the meeting.

In this second hour of testimony, we will hear from the Canadian Transportation Agency via video conference. Mr. Tom Oommen is the director general of the analysis and outreach branch.

Mr. Oommen, thank you for joining us. We'll turn it over to you for your opening remarks. You have five minutes.

[Tom Oommen, Director General, Analysis and Outreach Branch, Canadian Transportation Agency]

Thank you, Chair, for this opportunity to appear before the committee today.

As you know, the Canadian Transportation Agency is an independent administrative agency created by an act of Parliament.

The Canadian Transportation Agency is created by the Canada Transportation Act. As other administrative agencies, the Agency is part of the executive branch of government and is tasked with implementing government policies. It has a duty to be independent and impartial.

Under the Act, the Agency is given two roles. First, it acts as a quasi-judicial tribunal when deciding proceedings such as air travel complaints or rail complaints. Second, it acts as a regulatory body when making regulations, publishing guidelines, issuing determinations and enforcing compliance with the law. The Agency has to exercise all of its powers under both roles to fulfill its Parliament given mandate.

As a regulator, the agency issues licences to air carriers, issues the annual maximum revenue entitlement to CN and CP for the carriage of western grain for export, and approves railway line construction. The agency has also established and implemented the air passenger protection regulations—or APPR—the consumer protection regulations that apply to airlines.

The members of the agency, including the chair and CEO, are appointed by Governor in Council for fixed terms. The members are supported by a staff of public servants like me, who assist the members in their decision-making roles.

I understand that this committee is about ways to reduce red tape and costs for rural and urban airports to make air travel more affordable and more accessible. The agency's formal role with respect to airports is limited to accessibility for persons with disabilities.

With respect to accessibility at airports, the agency has established the regulatory framework and is responsible for enforcing that framework and helping to resolve passenger complaints, including through the formal adjudication of complaints by the agency, acting as a tribunal. Indeed, one of the agency’s core mandates is to protect the fundamental human right of persons with disabilities to accessible transportation services.

In 2019, the accessible transportation for persons with disabilities regulations—or ATPDR—were registered, with the majority of the provisions coming into force in 2020. Some more complex provisions were phased in over two years, with the final provisions coming into force in June 2022. The ATPDR apply to large federally regulated transportation carriers in the air, rail, marine and intercity bus modes, as well as to the terminals located in Canada that serve these carriers.

Air terminals and airports are subject to the ATPDR if they have emplaned or deplaned more than 200,000 air passengers in each of the two preceding calendar years or are located in a national or provincial capital.

With respect to air terminals and airports specifically, the ATPDR address key issues such as personnel training, as well as issues that were previously addressed through older regulations or codes of practice, such as the provision of wheelchairs and accessible self-service kiosks, as well as requirements for portable lifts, ramps or stairs necessary to board an aircraft.

The ATPDR also address issues that have been raised through consultations and through the agency’s complaints adjudication process, such as the requirement for curbside assistance and service dog relief areas on the secure side of a terminal.

With some exceptions, such as those just mentioned, the technical provisions for air terminals are forward-facing. This means they apply to modifications made to existing equipment or facilities and to future procurement. In these cases, there is no requirement to retrofit existing equipment and facilities.

Smaller airports that are not subject to the ATPDR are nonetheless subject to older provisions in the existing personnel training for the assistance of persons with disabilities regulations and relevant provisions of the agency’s six voluntary codes of practice.

In addition to the ATPDR, the agency has recently enacted the Accessible Transportation Planning and Reporting Regulations, or ATPRR. The ATPRR apply to all regulated entities that are required to meet any agency accessibility-related regulations. They require that accessibility plans and progress reports be published on a three-year cycle and that persons with disabilities be consulted on them. To assist regulated entities with the implementation of accessibility regulations, the agency has created resources which have been made available on its website, such as guidance material and training videos.

Thank you. I will be happy to take questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Mr. Oommen.

We'll begin our line of questioning today with Ms. Rood.

Ms. Rood, you have six minutes. The floor is yours.

[Lianne Rood, Conservative, Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Oommen, for appearing before us today.

Like many Canadians, I spent a bit of time in our airports this summer when travelling across this country. I met a lot of Canadians who were going on vacation for the first time in a couple of years and who maybe hadn't travelled at all throughout Canada during the pandemic and were really excited to be on their vacation.

As I was in an airport a number of times, I can think of one time in particular when about three-quarters of the flights on the board were either cancelled or delayed. There was nowhere to sit, not a chair to be found anywhere in the airport terminal. People were lying on the cement ground, sleeping on the ground, and there were long lineups to get food or drinks as they were waiting for hours and hours for their delayed flights. There was a lot of frustration among Canadians trying to travel.

I understand that there were probably a lot of complaints that came in to the agency. I heard that there was a backlog before summer travel of over 15,000 complaints to the CTA, before the big travel boom. I believe I have read—you may have stated it somewhere in the press—that there was an expectation of perhaps another 15,000 complaints by the end of this year.

I'm just wondering if you could update the committee on the current number of backlogged complaints at this point.

[Tom Oommen]

At the moment, our backlog is about 25,000 complaints. It was noted that over the summer the number of incoming complaints to the agency was high. Since then, the pace of complaints has slowed down somewhat, but I believe the current backlog is about 25,000 complaints.

[Lianne Rood, Conservative, Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON]

Thank you very much. That's a huge number. I'm not surprised by that, after talking with people who have had missing bags, or whose luggage was piled up in an airport waiting to be found, or who couldn't get through to an agent at an airline trying to find their lost baggage, or who had to wait in extremely long lines to even speak to an agent. I know many Canadians faced a lot of these obstacles and a lot of frustration. It's no surprise to hear you say that there are over 25,000 complaints that are backlogged right now.

My next question would be, was there any specific government action or inaction that perhaps prolonged the suffering of Canadian travellers to grow these complaints?

[Tom Oommen]

Mr. Chair, I can't really comment on the government action writ large. As I mentioned, the agency is an independent agency and we implement the regulatory framework.

I can say that over the course of the summer a number of decisions were issued by the agency that helped clarify and interpret the provisions of the air passenger protection regulations. Our expectation is that this clarity will influence both the airline behaviour and passenger expectations.

[Lianne Rood, Conservative, Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON]

Thank you.

I'm just wondering if you would be able to comment on whether the airlines would have been able to meet demand if perhaps federal mandates had been lifted sooner. Do you have any comment on that at all?

[Tom Oommen]

Mr. Chair, I can't really speculate on what would have happened if the mandate situation was lifted.

[Lianne Rood, Conservative, Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON]

That's fair enough.

Perhaps you could enlighten us about the status, then. With all of these backlogs, what is the status of hiring staff to review these complaints and fix these backlogs? Is there a timeline, or are there goalposts for the backlog reduction moving forward?

[Tom Oommen]

One important thing, Chair, is that the agency has become very efficient at processing complaints. Before the pandemic, in 2019, we were processing roughly 5,000 complaints a year. Through efficiencies, we've managed to increase that to 15,000 complaints on average in a year. We certainly increased our ability to handle complaints using the staff we have. Budget 2022 also provided $11.5 million to the agency to maintain a certain level of staffing that will allow us to maintain those numbers.

[Lianne Rood, Conservative, Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON]

Thank you.

We heard from the previous panel that the CTA lacks the authority to make sure consumers receive compensation. For airlines refusing the directive to compensate, what enforcement options does the CTA have available?

[Tom Oommen]

Chair, orders of the agency to compensate passengers are normally followed by airlines, unless the decisions of the agency are appealed, in which case there's an appeal process and the appeal process follows its due course. At the end of the day, airlines are required to follow the orders of the agency.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Mr. Oommen.

Thank you very much, Ms. Rood.

Next we have Mr. Hanley, joining us virtually.

Mr. Hanley, the floor is yours. You have six minutes.

[Brendan Hanley, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

Thank you, Mr. Chair and my committee colleagues, for allowing me to intervene on an important issue related to the economy and viability of smaller airports and airlines. It's an issue of particular relevance for rural Canadians.

As you're aware, Mr. Oommen, one of CTA's core mandates is to make sure our transportation system runs efficiently and smoothly in the interest of all Canadians, so I bring to you the issue of interline connections for smaller, regional airlines. My example is based here in the Yukon, the proud home of Air North, which provides regional air transport around the Yukon and also carries Yukoners south to destinations such as Vancouver, Edmonton, Calgary and seasonally to Ottawa and Toronto. Whitehorse, Yukon, is also serviced by major carriers, including Air Canada and WestJet, so that passengers have a choice of carrier.

It's worth noting that Air North is a locally owned and operated airline with substantial investments in local employment of ground crews, flight crews, pilots and maintenance, and a call centre for reservations. There are employment opportunities, as well as local training and capacity development. Air North even has an acclaimed flight kitchen based here in Whitehorse.

A robust local airline means successful investment and, therefore, sustainability in regional airports and the local economy. An interline agreement allows passengers to book connecting flights, hopefully, without issues. They don't need a second ticket, even if they have to change airlines. If they want to go from Toronto to Whitehorse, they book one ticket and one itinerary, even if they're changing air carriers along the way. For ease of travel and moving baggage, and to maximize airline capacity and efficiency, it's a sensible, consumer-focused measure.

According to Air North CEO Joe Sparling, from every community in Canada that gets scheduled air service, residents should be able to get to any other community, or even outside the country, as seamlessly and affordably as possible, and that's not the case now. In fact, a previous iteration of this committee called for interline agreements to be required—that was more than 20 years ago—to better serve Canadians, particularly those who rely on routes primarily flown by or connecting with regional airlines.

It's an issue of concern to Yukoners, but it's also an issue shared in widespread regions of Canada.

Mr. Oommen, as I understand it, Canada does not currently have mandatory interline agreements. I don't know, within your role at CTA, whether you can comment on that at all, or the importance that this could bring.

[Tom Oommen]

Chair, I don't really have any comments on mandatory interline agreements. What I can say is that the terms and conditions associated with interline agreements are in airline tariffs. When there are complaints, we use the tariffs to determine whether they have been followed or not.

I'll also mention the importance of section 64 of the act, which ensures that when airlines make reductions to their flight schedules that serve smaller communities, there is a process in place to ensure that the communities have an opportunity to comment on the proposed reductions. That exists, and it applies to small communities that are served by a limited number of airlines.

I know that's not the interline question that was asked, Chair, but I offer that as useful information.

[Brendan Hanley, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

Thank you.

I'm glad you brought up the issue of complaints, as well, because I was wondering whether, through complaints or through other means, you've heard in your agency role about this issue of mandatory interline agreements from a customer or client point of view.

[Tom Oommen]

Chair, the issue of interline agreements comes up in certain cases because passengers have an issue with how the interline arrangements were operated in a particular case. In those particular cases, the agency decides the issue based on the facts of the particular case.

[Brendan Hanley, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

Thank you.

Just to continue in that vein, northern and other more rural airline passengers can certainly encounter inconveniences if they run into delays or even miss a flight due to delays when they're trying to catch their next flight in the south. The question of interline agreements is not a one-way street. In fact, both major carriers and regional airlines, I believe, would benefit from more efficient travel routes and higher airline capacity.

Mr. Oommen, in your role, through the complaints you've received or the issues you've dealt with, do you think that a lack of interline agreements between major carriers and regional airlines puts rural, northern and remote Canadians, including indigenous Canadians, at a potential disadvantage due to travel plans and flight options to the communities they need to travel to?

[Tom Oommen]

Chair, as I said, I think that, where interline agreements are in place, they are enforced whenever they come up in complaints, and the agency pronounces upon whether the terms and conditions in an airline's tariff were respected or not in awarding compensation.

[Brendan Hanley, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

I thank you very much, Mr. Oommen, and I cede the remaining five seconds of my time.