Evidence of meeting #41 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was service.
A recording is available from Parliament.
5:45 p.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Urban Transit Association
Even for public transit systems as well, we have to renegotiate the price for diesel. We don't have an electric zero-emission fleet yet.
Going back to St. John's, Newfoundland, the amount that was negotiated between the mayor of St. John's and the province was very helpful, but a lot of that money was negated, because they have to rebid for diesel every Monday, for example. That's made it difficult to keep service running from an operating perspective.
5:45 p.m.
Conservative
Leslyn Lewis Conservative Haldimand—Norfolk, ON
I can't recall, but I believe it was Mr. Kanca who mentioned some issue with respect to supports for licensing requirements. That led me to think that perhaps there was a shortage of drivers and that the licensing requirements had something to do with it.
5:45 p.m.
Witness, Rider Express Transportation Corporation
No. Sorry. It was more about the fact that we have to be in a lot of cities and towns, and every city and town that we service requires a licence. All those licensing requirements add up. They start at $150 or $250, but when you're serving 100 cities or maybe more, it does add up.
5:45 p.m.
Conservative
Leslyn Lewis Conservative Haldimand—Norfolk, ON
Would harmonizing it or recognizing some sort of global or universal type of licence, so that you don't have to have licensing in every single city, make sense?
5:45 p.m.
Witness, Rider Express Transportation Corporation
That could certainly help a lot.
I just want to name a few of those fees and expenses. They don't appear at first glance, but when you are into it, they start appearing.
There's the IFTA requirement. You need to have special plates on your vehicles to do cross-border services. This is really a lot, considering you need to have this plate on all your vehicles. I don't want to go into too much detail about IFTA, but it was set up thinking that a trucker would be travelling from Ontario all the way to California, passing through many states, but in fact what we're doing is travelling through a few territories and provinces.
5:45 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Peter Schiefke
Thank you very much, Mr. Kanca, and thank you, Dr. Lewis.
If there's no objection from committee members, I just want to ask a follow-up question.
5:45 p.m.
Voices
Oh, oh!
5:45 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Peter Schiefke
It will be a very short question. Thank you, Mr. Bachrach.
You mentioned, Mr. D'Angelo, electrification of the fleet. I have a three-pronged question. A short response would be appreciated.
First, does the technology exist to actually transition to an electric fleet? In terms of the buses that would be used by Greyhound, for example, for 50 passengers, do electric versions of those vehicles exist?
Second, would it be helpful for funding to be put in place at either the provincial or federal level to help support that transition?
Third, would that help offset some of the costs and make it more affordable for consumers?
5:45 p.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Urban Transit Association
With electrification, distance is always an issue. Battery life is definitely something to think about when going a long distance. However, I'm very happy to talk about the bus manufacturers, including New Flyer, which builds MCI, and Nova Bus, which builds Prevost. There is a lot of leadership on that front in the design aspect.
There's also ZETF, the fund already announced by the federal government, which will assist with the transition. Certainly it's something that is worth considering.
You have to remember as well, as you're doing your study, the manufacturers in Winnipeg that are building the MCI coaches. Imagine how few tour buses or coach buses were being sold during the pandemic and the impact that's had on the industry there, as well as Prevost in Quebec. Canada has leadership in the manufacturing area in North America. It's important to keep that in mind as well as you continue your study.
5:50 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Peter Schiefke
Thank you very much, Mr. D'Angelo.
Thanks, committee members, for your indulgence.
Next we go to Mr. Chahal for five minutes. The floor is yours.
5:50 p.m.
Liberal
George Chahal Liberal Calgary Skyview, AB
Thank you, Chair.
Thank you to everybody providing testimony today.
Mr. Johnson, I want to go back to you with regard to leadership and roles. I know that in 2018 there was a federal-provincial intercity bus task force. Are you aware of the results of the work done on that task force and the collaboration provided between the federal government with the provinces? What was the result of that?
5:50 p.m.
President, Transport Action Canada
Actually, I'm not aware of any deliverable results of that task force. It is slightly before the time I became national president of Transport Action Canada. I was mostly working on advocacy in Ontario at that time. I am not aware of that task force having actually resulted in the federal government taking any concrete action to address the problems that exist.
5:50 p.m.
Liberal
George Chahal Liberal Calgary Skyview, AB
Mr. D'Angelo or Mr. Accardi, would you have information on that? Was there a response from the provinces in looking to collaborate further to create better coordination and opportunities to work together in western Canada?
Are you aware of any of the provinces looking to do so?
5:50 p.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Urban Transit Association
It's been a challenge. We've worked hard to build relationships with Prairie governments on that. We've had a great deal of success with Alberta. They were meeting the federal government halfway on operating funds and then looking at expanding services. We hope that continues, and we appreciate the private sector work that's being done in Saskatchewan.
I think that there's more to do in connecting communities in Manitoba and safely connecting communities that are north of Winnipeg. That's also been cited by the Amalgamated Transit Union in the study that they did as well.
5:50 p.m.
President, Motor Coach Canada
I'm aware that the provinces are actively looking at this and probably working with their neighbouring provinces, but I don't think that's going to get us a solution that will get Canadians across Canada.
5:50 p.m.
Liberal
George Chahal Liberal Calgary Skyview, AB
I think British Columbia has come forward with some solutions, but there's nothing concrete on the Prairie provinces.
I'm wondering about Saskatchewan, with the STC completely vacating and the lack of government support there. Has that been a challenge in Saskatchewan particularly, trying to connect mostly rural communities?
5:50 p.m.
President, Rider Express
Yes. We tried to connect with the Saskatchewan government. We haven't had any success with them. That includes Manitoba and Alberta. They haven't had any connection, even, with us.
British Columbia has had some funding with us and they've worked with us. Other than British Columbia, we haven't had any provincial government approach us.
5:50 p.m.
Liberal
George Chahal Liberal Calgary Skyview, AB
This is provincial jurisdiction and there's a lack of support from the provincial governments. I guess they've stepped out of providing any public support, other than the Province of British Columbia. That's a concern, because a lot of our Prairie provinces have rural communities and need better connectivity.
I know there was a pilot program in Alberta that would help support operators. Was your company a part of that pilot program, or did you have an opportunity to participate?
5:50 p.m.
President, Rider Express
No, we didn't. I think there were some rules saying our company wasn't fit for it.
5:50 p.m.
Liberal
George Chahal Liberal Calgary Skyview, AB
Okay, thank you.
I want to go to what we've seen in the U.S. and some opportunities in the U.S. in rural communities. Are there any innovative solutions we've seen from the United States that we can learn from to help incorporate here in Canada?
Mr. D'Angelo or Mr. Accardi, would you have anything?
5:55 p.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Urban Transit Association
One of the things that's been tremendously helpful through the Federal Transit Administration is that in the year 2020 the FTA funds were renewed for five years for, I believe, about $64 billion U.S., or something like that. Don't quote me; it's give or take. It does help to support the creation of transit.
States within the U.S. have regional transit authorities. They usually cover more than one municipality. It's very conducive to intercity transit simply by its nature. It's a bit of a different model.
5:55 p.m.
President, Motor Coach Canada
The U.S. handled their pandemic support for the industry very differently as well. Some of that support helped to backstop some of the losses that private carriers would have had from lack of ridership.
5:55 p.m.
Liberal
George Chahal Liberal Calgary Skyview, AB
That's in the same way that we provided support during the pandemic through funding directly to municipalities, or other funding sources as well.
5:55 p.m.
President, Motor Coach Canada
Yes. Our industry was very happy and thankful for the support we received from the government. It's just that the U.S. handled it a little bit differently.
