Veterans Affairs Committee on June 14th, 2007

[Ray Kokkonen]

I am not absolutely certain, but at this moment I don't think the generic United Nations peacekeeping medal is given to civilians; however, I could be wrong. I'm not aware of that at this time.

[Gilles-A. Perron, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Perhaps that would be something else to think about.

I'm a bit surprised to see that, in your statement, you continue to refer to the United Nations. Would a peacekeeping mission that is not sponsored by the UN but rather by NATO or another organization be recognized by your association?

[Ray Kokkonen]

Absolutely. If I used the term “United Nations”, it was inadvertent because we know there are many--as we discussed here during the meeting about the Peacekeepers Day, and it was brought out very clearly--colours of berets out there, not just the blue. There's orange, there's green--and they all fit into the umbrella under which I belong.

[Gilles-A. Perron, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

The beret colour, as you mentioned, indicates that they answer to NATO or other peacekeeping associations with which Canada is associated.

[Ray Kokkonen]

In our association, as I mentioned earlier, the membership is based on being a veteran under the definition given by the government. It is basically someone who has held a military occupation code and was honourably discharged. This means that someone can belong to the Canadian Peacekeeping Veterans Association by having gone through basic training and trades training, then having served maybe three years in Gagetown, and then being honourably released. That person is eligible to become a member. There is no limitation, particularly when it comes to other people who have served in operational theatres of some sort, such as NATO and other areas like that.

[Gilles-A. Perron, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

I don't want to put you in the hot seat, but I'd like to know whether you foresee the possibility of including citizens in your association.

[Ray Kokkonen]

Mr. Chair, perhaps I could answer that question. I hope I'm not being timed.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Anders]

There are no limits upon you, sir.

[Ray Kokkonen]

I have taken notes. I think this is a very important point. In my personal opinion, I think it is quite correct that civilians should be included as bona fide members, full members and not only associates, if they have done that kind of an operation. Other civilians who have not done anything in that sense I think will remain as associate members.

[Gilles-A. Perron, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for being understanding.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Anders]

I don't think we got a translation. She said it was inaudible. Anyhow, I'm sure it was a cute expression. In that light, I'm sure there will be many other cute expressions and questions coming up.

We'll now move to Mr. Stoffer with the NDP for five minutes.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Sir, it's good to see you again.

One of the concerns we have, as you are fully aware, is that by the end of this day this country will lose another 120 World War II, Korean, and modern-day veterans and/or their spouses. One of the concerns we have, of course, is when the veteran passes away, what happens to the widow or widower?

We keep hearing from previous and current governments that they're doing this review, or that review, but every day they delay there's another 120 who don't get the services they probably require. What should all of us, not only government but members of Parliament, be doing from all parties to ensure that the services you have provided are also assisted, because when you're going through your hard times...? You had 35 years in the military, and I'm sure a lot of those days were the best days of your life, but a few of those days were the worst days of your life.

I know that as people get older...like in the movie The Flags of Our Fathers, where the opening scene is an elderly gentleman and you see him shaking, it's his wife who is looking after him. That spouse or partner you have is a great source of comfort. When the veteran passes on and they're left behind, what more should we be doing in order to assist them, and how quickly should we be moving on it?

[Ray Kokkonen]

I'm not really qualified to say because I don't know enough about the background, but I do have some interesting statistics here. Currently, I think there are 298,000 who are war service survivors, and I assume those are widows and widowers; 22,500 receive services for housekeeping and grounds care; 28,400 are in long-term care facilities. In answer to your question, it seems that we are doing something. I don't know, am I arguing on behalf of someone here?

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

The problem is there are restrictions. If you make a certain amount of money, you don't qualify.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Anders]

Forgive me, Mr. Stoffer, I believe there's a point of order.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

I seldom do this in the committee, and I have great respect for Mr. Stoffer and all the passion he has, but I don't think we should put a witness in a difficult position to make a comment on government policy.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

I didn't.

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

I understand, but when asking how fast someone should move on it, that's the Government of Canada, and I don't think we should put our witness--

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

In great fairness, Mr. Sweet, I didn't mention a particular policy. I asked for services for veterans and their spouses. I didn't specify which ones.

What should we be doing as parliamentarians? It's not just previous or current governments, but all of us and what we can do to make sure their needs are met.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Anders]

Before we carry on with the discussion, I generally allow our committee members a great deal of leeway. I leave it to the witnesses to sleuth out the politics of the matter. I understand where Mr. Sweet is coming from, but I'll say that it's probably a point of debate.

Mr. Stoffer, you're free to--

[David Sweet, Conservative, Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON]

Mr. Chairman, I was just responding to Mr. Kokkonen's discomfort with the questions.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Anders]

I understand.

Well, Mr. Kokkonen is a--

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

With 35 years of service, I don't think he's in discomfort at all.

[Ray Kokkonen]

Could I just say something here?

I will return to my original statement: I am not qualified to answer that question.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Anders]

You're perfectly welcome to say that--