Veterans Affairs Committee on Sept. 29th, 2011

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

Good morning, everybody. Now that we have a quorum and we have our witnesses before us, we will start the proceedings.

Conversations on the side I hope will be at a minimum while the witnesses are addressing us.

The norm is that the witnesses will have ten minutes to give an overview. There's a lot more that I know they could share, depending on how much information there is, so the questions may lead to more advanced information. Because we're starting at five minutes to nine, we're going to go to five minutes to ten. We've set an hour for this part of it. We'll have a brief adjournment and then go into the business section.

First, I'd like to say, as we know, that this is under Standing Order 108, a briefing on departmental programs and policies.

We're very pleased this morning to have with us, from the Department of Veterans Affairs, Bernard Butler, who has been here with us before. He is the director general of policy and research. Also, we have with us Charlotte Stewart, who we've met before as well and who is the director general, service delivery and program management. We have both the service side and the policy side represented this morning.

Welcome. It's nice to have you before the committee. It is a new session of Parliament and a new committee, and we have a number of new members on the committee. We look forward to your presentation.

Thank you, and please feel free to go ahead.

[Charlotte Stewart, Director General, Service Delivery and Program Management, Department of Veterans Affairs]

Thank you very much.

Good morning, Mr. Chair and committee members. It is indeed a pleasure to be here this morning and to have the opportunity to speak to you about Veterans Affairs Canada as we enter what is a very exciting but challenging time in our history. I am pleased to appear before you with Bernard Butler, who has been introduced.

We'll have an opportunity this morning to talk to you about the department in terms of its basic structure and some information that I think you'll find valuable in terms of how we work, our budgets, etc. I'll move quickly through that; I know you've received a deck that outlines that information for you. Then what we really want to talk about is the progress and improvements we're making as we serve our veterans.

When I mention that this is a very challenging time, I say that because at this point, for the first time in our history, we're serving more modern-day veterans, those who have served after World War II and the Korean War, than traditional veterans. They have different needs and expectations, and it's very important for us as a department to make sure we're responsive to that.

Very quickly, I will speak a bit about our organization. I know you're familiar with our mandate, but we're proud to say that since 1919 we have served to provide for the needs and benefits of veterans in Canada. Second, we make sure that their actions are commemorated appropriately, both in Canada and internationally.

Within our organization, our minister has three main elements reporting: the deputy minister, of course, who is the chief administrator of our department; the veterans ombudsman, established in 2007, who provides an independent review of issues in the department, works very closely with stakeholders, and ensures that those issues are brought forward to us; and the Veterans Review and Appeal Board, which has been in place for many years and provides a vehicle for those veterans who have an issue or are dissatisfied with a decision on their disability program to bring it back to the department for a review.

I want to talk a bit about our staff. We have about 3,800 full-time equivalents. That's a bit of a bureaucratic term, but basically those are the people across the country who are there to provide services to veterans. What's important for this number is that of those, over 70% provide direct client service. So those are the people who are on the ground, who are providing or administering direct benefits.

Our head office is in Charlottetown, which makes us unique among federal departments. We also have 2,000 employees across the country working within our regional and district offices. These are the employees who are the face of our department. They're the case managers and other health professionals who work one-on-one with our veterans, ensure that their needs are understood and fully met, and make sure they get the benefits and services they need.

Our portfolio spending for this year is upwards of $3.5 billion. What's important in that number is that 90% of that is direct transfers to our veterans. What that means is that 90% of it is for disability pensions or disability awards or direct treatment--things like drugs, audiology services, dental care. Those are the services that we provide to our veterans. So of the $3.5 billion, 90% of it goes directly to the veterans. Only 10% of our overall budget goes to support overhead, which is generally seen as being salaries and regular operating costs to maintain a department. This is a very small overall percentage.

I want to talk now about demographics, because this is key to our story today. Our demographics are changing dramatically. There's a chart on page 6 of the deck. Let me just talk about it in terms of what it means to us and what it means to you, as committee members, in terms of understanding what we're dealing with now.

This year, as I mentioned, for the first time in our history we're serving more modern-day veterans than our traditional war-service veterans. The numbers are fairly equal, but there are more modern-day veterans. By 2015 there will be three times more modern-day veterans than traditional war-service veterans. These two client groups have different needs and expectations, and our department has to be set up properly to meet those needs and expectations.

We know that you're quite familiar with some of the needs of our department going way back, but in more recent history we've received a lot of direct feedback, input, and criticism that we weren't there and ready to meet the needs of our modern-day veterans. That's one area we've worked on very hard. We've made good progress and we want to speak to that again this morning.

When we talk about our modern-day veterans, we know they have very complex needs. We know that they've served as career soldiers and that in many cases this was their occupation. They wanted to stay in the military. Those who are leaving need to be transitioned. They need help with re-adapting or transitioning to civilian life. That's where Veterans Affairs first meets them, and it's a very important point in our interaction with them.

As for traditional war veterans, it is very important that we're there for them right now. In many cases they're facing issues of aging and, sadly, in many cases, end-of-life issues. We want to be there to support them and their families.

So how do we serve them? It's about our people and the people on the ground. When I talk about the changes we've made, as someone in service delivery, I'll be talking about the changes we've made that make it better on the ground.

I mentioned 2,000 employees who provide direct client service. We have 60 locations across the country. These are where people can walk in and get help and meet a case manager or other professionals to assist them.

We have a very new and important service delivery model in partnership with DND, the Department of National Defence, with integrated personnel support centres. We're now co-located with them on bases and wings across the country. We actually have a presence at over 30 sites with them. We have 24 formal arrangements on the ground and over 100 staff working on these bases. That's where DND and VAC can work together, right from the first step of an individual wanting to leave the military and therefore build that relationship and ensure a smooth transition.

As part of service delivery, we're overhauling everything we do. We're looking at every step in our processes. We're cutting red tape. We've reduced turnaround times for major programs, which is going to show up with veterans knowing and feeling that they're getting better service. We're getting more front-line staff and better delegation of authority, so that staff can make decisions faster. We're going to align our resources with where we need them and are adding resources across the country where needed. We're also building our partnership with DND, a cornerstone of the work we will continue to do to make sure there's a transition between the two departments. We won't use the word “seamless”; it's never going to be seamless, but we're making it better.

At this point, Bernard is going to give an overview of our new programs and services.

[Bernard Butler, Director General, Policy and Research Division, Department of Veterans Affairs]

Thank you, Charlotte.

Bonjour. Ça me fait plaisir d'être ici encore une fois, Mr. Chair and members, before the committee to share with you some of the progress we're making.

I'm going to talk just very briefly, because I know our time is short, about our benefits and services and how they reflect the change in demographics Charlotte has referred to.

Traditional veteran programming has been in place for many years. And when we talk about traditional veterans we're talking about World War I, World War II, and Korean veterans. For that group of veterans, that older group of veterans, we've had a number of programs that have been in place, as I say, for many, many years. Essentially these were two programs, which we call gateway programs. The first one was the disability pension program, which was designed to compensate veterans for injuries that were service-related. The other major program was an income-tested program, the war veterans allowance. And those were the two main vehicles whereby traditional veterans would access benefits through the Department of Veterans Affairs.

As Charlotte has indicated, we are now in a major transition. This is the first year, the year 2011, when the number of traditional veterans now is actually less than the number of modern veterans we're serving. And modern veterans are defined simply as those Canadian Forces members who have served since the end of the Korean War.

In the early 2000s it became apparent through various discussions with stakeholders, members, and veterans that the traditional programming was not meeting the needs of the younger veterans, particularly in the context of enabling them to move from living and working in a military environment to a civilian environment. Through a period of research and consultation that was quite extensive over time, the Government of Canada adopted, in 2006, the new Veterans Charter. And this was a series of programs basically designed to support the rehabilitation, transition, and reintegration of younger members of the Canadian Forces into civilian life.

On slide 9 you'll see a summary of those benefits and services for modern-day veterans.

We refer to things like disability benefits, which have taken the form now of a disability award, but also major programming to support rehabilitation, financial support, health benefits, and related services.

In the next few weeks there will be major improvements to the new Veterans Charter, which are referred to as Bill C-55, new Veterans Charter enhancements. When these come into effect, they will ensure an additional infusion of financial benefits for the most seriously disabled Canadian Forces members and markedly improve the economic conditions of those individuals who find themselves unable to restore themselves fully. They will benefit markedly from these types of improvements.

Those are some of the changes we are making on the program policy side of the department. You will find that when you compare the two suites of benefits you always have to bear in mind that the policy basis for the benefits and services for traditional veterans has changed and shifted over the last number of years. So we've moved away from a pension model to a wellness, re-establishment, and rehabilitation model. And that's what the new Veterans Charter is essentially all about.

As Charlotte has indicated, there is a whole range of other programs that modern-day veterans can access through the department. Some of these relate to our mental health strategy, which is designed to address the emerging mental health challenges of the younger modern veteran, with a series of operational clinics across the country. We have beefed up resources in terms of our capacity and our case management across the country and have specialized mental health resources that are available to support members and veterans who are transitioning and have these types of challenges.

That's just a very quick overview of some of the changes we are engaged in, in terms of programming and services.

With that, I'm just going to skip quickly to the last slide of the deck.

Remembrance programming is another key element of what engages Veterans Affairs. I understand that our director general for Canada Remembers will actually be appearing before the committee over the next short while, and there will be ample opportunity at that time to have a more fulsome discussion of that.

Mr. Chairman, in consideration of your very tight time limits I'm going to cease talking and turn the floor back to you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

Thank you, Mr. Butler and Ms. Stewart. I know it's the kind of story that could go on for a long time. We appreciate your time.

I want to point out that the rotation was set up last spring, so we will start with the NDP and go to the Conservatives. We'll ask you to indicate who is going to be the first speaker on each side.

Mr. Stoffer has already been suggested to us, so we'll begin the clock now with the NDP, then go to the Conservatives and the Liberals.

Mr. Stoffer.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Thank you. I'll be sharing my time with my colleague Irene Mathyssen.

To both of you, thank you very much for coming. I know all too well the challenges facing your department in the transformation from what we call the ancient veterans to the modern-day veterans. I wish you good luck on that.

I have a couple of questions. I understand there's some sort of discussion with the advisory board of a reorganization on your advisory board that we called the gerontological advisory board at one time. I wonder if you can advise us on how that is going.

My second question is to clear the air. As you know, there were media reports last year regarding the release of medical information on Sean Bruyea. It was an unfortunate circumstance and was quite serious in its tone. I'm wondering if you can tell us what procedures are now in place to ensure that no person ever has to go through that again.

Thank you so much.

[Bernard Butler]

Thank you, Mr. Stoffer.

With respect to the first question, I can certainly advise you as follows. As you know, over the past number of years the department has profited from numerous advisory groups and bodies. The Gerontological Advisory Council was one of them; the New Veterans Charter Advisory Group was another. Those groups provided invaluable expertise and advice to us over time. Those bodies helped to formulate some of the basic principles of the new Veterans Charter. In the case of the New Veterans Charter Advisory Group, they provided invaluable commentary on the charter as proposed and on the implementation, and indeed in terms of recommendations for follow-up.

What we have found, however--and where we are at this point in time--is that the department has determined that we really need now to move away from those types of traditional groups. They took a long time to formulate reports, and because of the structure--not because of the individuals--they were sometimes not as responsive as the department now needs to be. We are now in an environment where we need to be very nimble, flexible, and able to respond to policy issues more quickly than we have in the past.

What we have done now is determined that a stakeholder advisory committee is the way of the future. As a result of that we have invited to the table a broad range of stakeholders. The first planning session of this committee was set up in June 2011, at which time our assistant deputy minister, James Gilbert, chaired a meeting with representatives from all the traditional organizations, such as the Royal Canadian Legion, the War Amputations of Canada, ANAVETS, and all those groups, as well as with some of the more modern groups, such as the Canadian Veterans Advocacy group and the NATO associations.

We now have a group with a broad range of people around the table. We'll be meeting again with them in October to finalize the terms of reference. That broad stakeholder committee will be a committee that we will look to for help in providing us with feedback on issues that are in the public domain, issues of concern to the membership around that table. They will also be a sounding board for issues that we choose to put before them to get commentary on and so on.

This is a new approach. It's a new strategy. We believe that it's innovative. We believe that it's creative. We believe it's the way to ensure broad engagement of veterans organizations. We've made a commitment to all of the individuals around that table that we will evolve with the structure as their needs and our needs evolve.

So we're moving into a new environment. We're moving into a new era. It will not be new to any of the members of the committee that government generally, Veterans Affairs for sure, has to be equally as responsive to the modern groups as to the traditional. Some of the modern groups are not as organized structurally, but they have a great deal of influence in terms of the social media. They have a broad reach, and we need to engage those folks. That's what we are trying to do now through the advisory committee.

In terms of the second question you posed, on the privacy issue, I can assure the committee members here that the Department of Veterans Affairs took this issue exceedingly seriously. It was most unfortunate and regrettable as it unfolded. As a result of that, working with the Privacy Commissioner and with our advisors in central agencies on privacy issue management the department embarked on a very ambitious privacy management action plan to address the concerns and to assure veterans that the information they share with us will be secure, it will be protected, and they should not have concerns into the future.

Elements of that privacy action plan include broad-based training of every employee, reminding them of the basic principles of privacy in information management. I think we're in a good position.

The chair is indicating the need to move on.

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

I'm sorry about that. I just want to indicate that we're past the five minutes now, so Mr. Stoffer's two questions covered the NDP's time.

We'll now turn to the Conservatives for five minutes. I'll ask you to focus, please.

[Eve Adams, Conservative, Mississauga—Brampton South, ON]

Thanks very much, and thank you for your presentation.

Could you perhaps provide us with some insight into the enhancements from the new Veterans Charter and how they actually provide improved financial benefits to our veterans or most seriously injured veterans?

[Bernard Butler]

Thank you for that. I would certainly be pleased to.

With the new Veterans Charter enhancements, there are a number of key elements to it that members around the committee should be aware of. The first one is that over the last few years we were getting advice and we were determining that the income support program, the earnings loss benefit, which is payable to members who are in our rehabilitation program, was not sufficient for low-income veterans.

A group that was most impacted was the group who might have been released a number of years ago at a very low level in the military. If you take an example of a private who might have been released several years ago, if he or she entered our programming today, they would not have an income level sufficient to sustain their needs and the needs of their family. The new Veterans Charter enhancements will ensure that at very minimum those members will receive an income support level of $40,000 a year. That's the minimum threshold.

For those individuals who were released at higher pay salaries, they will receive 75% of their release salary during the time that they're in our rehabilitation program, and if they cannot be rehabilitated and they cannot return to the work environment, then that earning loss benefit will continue on until they are age 65.

Another major enhancement of the new Veterans Charter is the provision of an additional $1,000-a-month benefit through our permanent impairment allowance program for those most seriously disabled. If an individual finds himself or herself in a situation where they're suffering permanent and severe impairment and they cannot return to suitable and gainful employment, those individuals will now receive an additional $1,000 a month payable for life.

The third element of the program is that we've ensured that members who are receiving benefits under the old pension legislation we talked about and people receiving benefits under the new system--some veterans receive them under both.... It was an oversight in the development of the charter, but we now through the enhancements have ensured that they can actually calculate or take into account benefits they're receiving under each act, to ensure that they maximize opportunity for access to exceptional incapacity allowance under the Pension Act and access to our permanent impairment award under the new legislation. That's a significant improvement for veterans.

The final advantage of the new Veterans Charter will be we're going to be giving access to payment options for the lump sum award. You may remember controversy over the last few years. There was concern that there were some younger veterans in particular who might receive a large lump sum disability award for a service-related disability and might in fact not spend it wisely. The response to that through these enhancements will be to enable, with financial planning, members who receive these benefits to elect to take that lump sum as a whole or to take it in a combination of a lump sum and an annual payment or to take the full amount in an annual payment over time.

Those are the key changes that will come. These will add significantly to the financial benefits payable to veterans. Essentially what it will ensure is that younger veterans, the modern veterans who are entering these programs, will be assured of at least a minimum of a $58,000 payment from the Government of Canada while they are in rehabilitation or thereafter if they can't be rehabilitated for those who are the most seriously disabled.

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

We have less than a minute for a quick question and answer if you want to do it.

[Eve Adams, Conservative, Mississauga—Brampton South, ON]

It's always difficult. We've said that these young soldiers are old enough to go and lay their lives on the line in defence of our nation's interests. When they return, I think it's a very difficult proposition to say that they are not responsible enough to accept a lump sum amount.

I think it's a good thing though that the new Veterans Charter enhancements allow for the choice for the veterans. If they would like to receive the lump sum amount because they would like to buy a home or start a business or for whatever reason it might be, that's available for them, but if they would like to continue receiving a monthly payment that allows them to pace their income, that's also an option available to them.

Could you perhaps explain to me--

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

Ms. Stewart, you are now past the allotted time, so he wouldn't get a chance to answer, unfortunately.

Next on the list is Mr. Casey, for five minutes.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Good morning.

Could you tell us about the last post fund?

[Charlotte Stewart]

I have some information on the last post fund. Currently they administer, for instance, our funerals and burials program on our behalf.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

If you were to look at the three most pressing, important issues and challenges within the department and for veterans generally, at the present time and into the foreseeable future, what would they be? What are the big ones?

[Bernard Butler]

Three of the most pressing issues—that's an excellent question.

The department is going through major changes in terms of improvements to service delivery mechanisms, as you know. We're going through changes in our programming in terms of enhancements, as we talked about with the new Veterans Charter. We're in a process of looking at things like our health benefits programs and ensuring that they're modernized and brought up to date to ensure they are reflective of emerging needs. I think that some of the biggest challenges for us over time will be ensuring that we continue to be responsive to the emerging needs and the emerging expectations of the younger veteran. Rehabilitation and transitional issues are the ones we will probably be looking at. Mental health issues for veterans will continue to be a major challenge for us. It will be up to us to stay on top of that to ensure that we're meeting their needs.

In terms of trying to characterize them into any one specific category, that would be difficult. Our focus is on being responsive to those transitional needs, on ensuring that they do in fact adapt and make the adjustment to life, that they become rehabilitated and that they become meaningful contributors to society. Those are the kinds of challenges younger veterans will face, and we will be there to try to support them in those.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

I was interested to hear that commemoration wasn't one of them.

The next question is for Ms. Stewart. I know that the language issues within the department are part of the transformation agenda, but you said that you're going to be, if I took it down correctly, adding resources across the country. I take it from that comment that the transformation agenda involves a reallocation of resources and not necessarily a broad-based cut.

When you talk about adding resources across the country, does that also include head office?

[Charlotte Stewart]

When we speak about our modernization agenda or transformation, we're looking at making sure we have the right resources where we need them. This is critical, because as the number of traditional war service veterans declines, we'll be reallocating resources from the areas in which we had invested to serve their needs, to areas where we have more need, for instance, for the CF. That's usually closer to bases.

If you look at the level of activity close to Valcartier, in Halifax, in Edmonton, and in Petawawa, there's a very high level of activity around the modern-day veterans. We will be making sure we have sufficient case managers and other support people there to meet their needs. So we're working to design a service model that allows us to have the flexibility to move resources.

On reallocation, overall the department's clients' numbers will be declining in the future, as our forecasts show. Generally speaking the department, as with all departments, will make sure it's efficient in its operations and we have the people we need, but we won't have more people than we need.

When I mentioned adding people, we've actually added 20 case managers in the last year and a half to those bases in those areas where we needed them most.

Charlottetown is our head office. It also has a significant client service group there. We have to make sure that our supporting infrastructure around the department is the right size. So as we rebalance and get the right fit around front-line service, our supporting infrastructure, be it in Charlottetown or anywhere else, will have to be appropriately sized.

We can see a shift over time to some offices getting smaller as the need arises, and some getting larger. The key point is that it will all be based on the front line and the number of people on the ground in major areas across the country who need case management services.

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

Thank you, Ms. Stewart. The time is up for that one.

We'll now go to Mr. Lobb for five minutes.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Thank you very much.

My first question is directed towards Ms. Stewart.

In the 2011-12 planning priorities there are a few measurables. One of them is if a member is satisfied with their life--the target is 70%.

Colonel Stogran had some pretty pointed remarks about delivery of service and the experience of the veteran when they're receiving that service. What targets and goals have you set to actually record your objectives?

[Charlotte Stewart]

Thank you.

There are many, and they cover the range of our service delivery. First of all, we want to improve our turnaround time from when a veteran asks for a service to when the benefit is received.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

How do you plan on measuring that so the new veterans ombudsman, the members of this committee, the Legion, and members of the veterans community can see that? How is that going to be published?

[Charlotte Stewart]

We will be publishing our service standards. We have improved our service standard for disability programs--first applications--from 24 weeks to 16 weeks. That has been measured, and we're now meeting that target consistently. That's a key improvement, and that is the program that affects the highest number of our clients. That's a very significant improvement in a fairly short period of time.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Will there be a mechanism for the people receiving the services to have a say? I get that you're saying it's 22 to 16, but is there a way for Joe the service person to say “Yes, I feel very satisfied”? Does he have a chance to express whether 16 weeks works for him or not?

[Charlotte Stewart]

They have various means. One is our client satisfaction survey, which we encourage all of our clients to participate in. We work very hard to reach them. In the last little while we've taken new measures to reach out to the newer veterans to ensure that they're responding to that mechanism. When these clients speak with their case managers and other people, they pass on their feedback very directly. They can work through the various organizations they are associated with. The ombudsman, of course, is another key element in our communication. We hear from them as well. So there are formal and informal mechanisms.