Evidence of meeting #23 for Veterans Affairs in the 42nd Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was going.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Retired Peer Support Coordinator, Veteran, As an Individual
Do you mean the JPSU or the OSI clinic?
Retired Peer Support Coordinator, Veteran, As an Individual
Well, it's an access point. We used to call them a holding platoon; we all had them. Once they know you're going to be released, you are posted over to the JPSU, literally, from your home unit. That allows your unit now to bring somebody in behind you. Before, the units would have up to 90 people on categories, so they've created this organization you go to. Again, it's, “Come in and report.” It's almost like being in the old unemployment system. You had to come in every week to say, “Hi. Are there any jobs?” They'd say, “No”, and away you go.
People get what they want out of it. Some don't; some do. A lot of them are just satisfied that they don't have to go into their unit anymore, and they're just waiting for the day when they're let go. It's pretty grim, when you talk to the fellas. There is no enthusiasm in actually being there. It has a detrimental sort of feeling to it. It's another step. You've lost your unit, the guys you served with. You're with a bunch of people you don't know. Next thing you know, you are transitioning out to a civilian world that you don't know.
Conservative
Alupa Clarke Conservative Beauport—Limoilou, QC
Mr. Estabrooks, what would you add that is wrong with the JPSU?
Volunteer Peer Support Advisor, Veteran, As an Individual
Probably just that they are severely understaffed. For job placements, for example, there is one individual in the one in Gagetown. He places absolutely everyone who comes in through that job. I forget the numbers, but it's absolutely ridiculous. He has about nine places that have opened up and said they would take people. He has an impossible task.
Conservative
Vice-President, Program Delivery, Shaping Purpose
Personally, I didn't have an issue with the JPSU itself. For me, it was definitely the anxiety of driving out to the base, the 20-minute drive, white-knuckling, palms sweating, and heart just going out of my chest.
Conservative
Robert Gordon Kitchen Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
Thank you very much.
Thank you for the chance to ask you again.
We heard it from Mr. Doucette, and comments from all of you.... The comment was about second-guessing by VAC after DND has made decisions on health care issues. Is that a common consensus from the people you talk to?
Veteran, Trauma Healing Centers
Is that in regard to injuries in the military being diagnosed and then refused afterwards?
Conservative
Robert Gordon Kitchen Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
Correct. Would you like to start, Mr. Bungay?
Veteran, Trauma Healing Centers
Yes, it happens all the time. I think it's DND's duty to make sure they know everything that's wrong with those soldiers. Who better to know what's wrong than the doctors who have been watching them for their whole careers? They do have first-hand experience.
Depending on what CU, and that's the hospital care delivery unit.... You know, I had the same doctor for five or six years. When it was all said and done, at the end he knew exactly what was going on. He watched me deteriorate, and he tried to help as much as he could. At the end of the day, when he wrote his report, he said, “This is what he's going through, what he's been through, and this is what needs to happen.”
For me, I wasn't letting it go, and I was going to get what I wanted. But the frustration with veterans is the no, no, no. They know that most of them are going to go, “I can't handle this. I'm out of here.”
Retired Peer Support Coordinator, Veteran, As an Individual
A lot of people give up on the system.
You'd be surprised at how many veterans out there made that initial access, were refused, and just walked away from it. The anxiety, frustration, anger, and all that, didn't weigh enough to carry on with pursuing whatever it was they were trying to get.
This is common, even with World War II vets. When my dad was refused the war veterans allowance, he said, “Well, the government said....” That's what he said. I said, “Well, no, try it again.” He eventually did, but it was that attitude.
With the mental issues the guys have, they just say, “I don't need this anymore. I don't want it. I don't care what comes with it.”
Liberal
Doug Eyolfson Liberal Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you all for coming here, and thank you for your service. It is very much appreciated.
We've talked about the deficiencies in OSI. Are there things that are working well with OSI, and are there things within that system that they might be able to improve to make it better?
I'll start with Mr. Doucette.
Retired Peer Support Coordinator, Veteran, As an Individual
It's education. Education is the thing. Period.
Understand the injury. If you have a busted hip, it's too easy. You look at an X-ray and you see the marks and that.
On the mental health side, the people dealing with these veterans have to have some knowledge to it. I think mandatory education programs to bring people up to speed with what they're dealing with would make a big difference.
Liberal
Doug Eyolfson Liberal Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB
Would you say there are things that are done well there?
Retired Peer Support Coordinator, Veteran, As an Individual
Over the past several years, yes. Some of the case managers are doing amazing work. There is more info getting out to the veterans, but it's piecemeal.
As some of the fellows have said, most of the knowledge comes from word of mouth, from somebody who accessed it, and this is whether it was a success or failure, or whatever it was.
Liberal
Doug Eyolfson Liberal Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB
Thank you.
You mentioned that when you're in active service, you're under the care of a Department of National Defence physician. Then you're under a different physician under VAC.
When you transition and you are under Veterans Affairs, are you assigned a physician by Veterans Affairs?
Retired Peer Support Coordinator, Veteran, As an Individual
No. That's another big problem. When you're released, nobody gets you a doctor. Nobody facilitates that.
A lot of fellows who leave are lining up with the provincial list to try to get a doctor. Other than that, they go to one of the walk-in clinics. The walk-in clinics aren't designed to fill out paperwork and sort out your concerns.
That's something that's missed, a lot.
Luckily, I had a family doctor, so I just slid in under the door, “I'm back in the family now, so help me out.” But in a lot of cases, people have no doctor at all.
Liberal
Doug Eyolfson Liberal Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB
That sounds like a major deficiency.
I'm a physician myself. I work in emergency, and regularly see patients who get all their care through the emergency department because they've been looking for a family doctor for months. I find that quite disturbing that one isn't assigned at that level.
Vice-President, Program Delivery, Shaping Purpose
I was released in 2013, June. I was told to put in my application for a physician six months ahead of time, so I did it around the January timeframe. I didn't get a doctor until this past year, so in 2016.
Up until that point in time, I was waiting at 5:30 in the morning, in the dead cold of winter, to go and get paperwork signed by a doctor at the walk-in clinic. In Fredericton, you had to be there at 5:30, because the doors opened to the building at 6:00, then you waited outside the clinic from 6:00 until 7:30, and then the office opened its doors at 7:30. Then you put your name on a list, and if you weren't in the first 20 or so people you were not getting seen that day because it was only open until 12:00.
Liberal
Doug Eyolfson Liberal Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB
In my humble opinion, that's appalling. I think we all owe you an apology for that deficiency in the system.
Mr. Bungay, in regard to your Trauma Healing Centers, what would you say is the most common ailment or problem that you see? Are you able to pinpoint the most common one that is seen at your centres?
