Evidence of meeting #61 for Veterans Affairs in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was france.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Project Manager, General Secretariat for Administration, Ministère des Armées
Yes, absolutely. It really depends on how serious the injury is.
NDP
Irene Mathyssen NDP London—Fanshawe, ON
Thank you.
I'm wondering about the training. You said that you have contracted an outside agency to provide training and support for job transition. Are there rules about who gets that training? For example, here, a certain amount of money is awarded to someone leaving the military to pursue higher education or training opportunities. Do you have that same kind of situation, in which there is a variation in how much support is available for re-education or training?
Project Manager, General Secretariat for Administration, Ministère des Armées
The answer is extremely variable depending on the injuries. Ultimately, we don't have a payment scale based on a category. Some injured individuals will require a much longer support period, while others will return immediately. So there aren't pre-set amounts.
NDP
Irene Mathyssen NDP London—Fanshawe, ON
So it's simply what the individual needs, without any encumbrances.
Project Manager, General Secretariat for Administration, Ministère des Armées
Yes, absolutely. We try to provide personalized support. After that, training may cost more depending on the needs of the individual. So, of course, all of this is managed. We can't imagine offering all the training, but we try to respond to a variety of needs.
NDP
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Neil Ellis
Sorry, we've maxed out on this one. Thank you.
Ms. Wagantall, you have six minutes.
Conservative
Cathay Wagantall Conservative Yorkton—Melville, SK
Thank you again.
Disability pension systems, for us and obviously for you as indicated here, are complex. When your members receive that disability pension—they've qualified for it, it's all set in place—what are the parameters or conditions under which that pension can be impacted by other social benefits, or any other employment income they may receive?
Project Manager, General Secretariat for Administration, Ministère des Armées
Indeed, injured soldiers don't have just the military disability pension, they will have other associated rights, which includes health care coverage that will take into account medical care and equipment. We will even fund up to 100% for next generation prostheses for individuals, for soldiers who want to reintegrate into the professional world. These next generation prostheses, which can cost up to 100,000 euros, are covered for these people who want to reintegrate.
That's not the only thing. There are other measures. We have an iconic institution called the Institution nationale des invalides that injured individuals, throughout their journey, and probably also at the end of their lives, can enter as patients and receive specific support.
Conservative
Cathay Wagantall Conservative Yorkton—Melville, SK
Are there any circumstances under which, if they were to receive some other funding from the government, the disability amount they're receiving would be reduced?
Project Manager, General Secretariat for Administration, Ministère des Armées
No, no. It's a scale based on a disability rate, and the portion is not reduced based on what is proposed in terms of the care path.
Conservative
Cathay Wagantall Conservative Yorkton—Melville, SK
Thank you.
In Canada, and what we've discovered in this committee, veterans care for veterans. A lot of them have developed programs or methods of reaching out to other veterans in order to improve their quality of life, and a lot of really good programs are available to them. Do you find that in France as well? Are there ways the government is engaging those groups, to use them as third parties to provide services, or to improve the welfare of veterans?
September 26th, 2017 / 9:55 a.m.
Project Director to the Executive Director, Office national des anciens combattants et victimes de guerre, ministère des Armées
Historically, this also happened in France.
Right after the First World War, it is true that the government was fairly restrained. Veterans associations organized themselves to set up their own structures and assistance programs.
For example, it was these veterans associations that, after the First World War, created vocational retraining schools. These schools were places where disabled individuals, who were missing an arm or a leg, could learn a new trade. At the very start, in the 1920s and 1930s, it was the veterans associations that set up these structures and programs. The situation is different these days, meaning that the government is, on the one hand, more present and, on the other, the veterans associations in France are quite aging.
Conservative
Cathay Wagantall Conservative Yorkton—Melville, SK
So there aren't newer groups stepping in and doing this type of thing; the focus is more on the government care.
Project Director to the Executive Director, Office national des anciens combattants et victimes de guerre, ministère des Armées
The new groups, as you call them, are struggling to establish a presence. There are large associations that are very well established in the landscape and they still work a lot for veterans, especially of Algeria. They are also becoming interested in young people from external operations. To be very clear, the community of veterans is less proactive than it was after the First World War.
I don't know if the commissioner agrees with me.
Conservative
Conservative
Phil McColeman Conservative Brantford—Brant, ON
Thank you.
I recall a program that was begun to help transition the Canadian veteran into the workplace, and it was specific to construction. Someone help me with the name of that program.
Conservative
Phil McColeman Conservative Brantford—Brant, ON
Thank you.
The construction industry partnered with Veterans Affairs to help the veterans who had an interest in some kind of future in construction, be it in carpentry, plumbing, whatever the trade.
Is there anything like that in France as far as your transition programs are concerned?
Project Director to the Executive Director, Office national des anciens combattants et victimes de guerre, ministère des Armées
In France, there are reserved jobs that prioritize injured veterans. They have bridges to connect more easily with the public service.
Your question deals more specifically with the private sector. Some sectors of our economy are interested in recruiting veterans and perhaps injured soldiers.
Mr. Commissioner, do you have any additional information?
Project Manager, General Secretariat for Administration, Ministère des Armées
We are trying to establish enabling agreements with large companies to get them to hire injured soldiers. The main difficulty we are encountering is that the availability of companies doesn't strictly match the demand of wounded soldiers, particularly from a geographic perspective. The company may have a lot of job offers for injured soldiers in the Paris area, where there are large groups, but our injured soldiers may prefer a life in the provinces.
So that's the challenge we have right now.
Liberal
Doug Eyolfson Liberal Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB
Thank you very much for coming.
I'd like to make reference to a question Ms. Wagantall asked earlier regarding actively serving personnel who have been injured.
I'm contrasting the two different systems we have in Canada and the United States. In Canada we have what's called the universality of service, which means that if a soldier is unable to be deployed in any role he or she might be called upon to fill, then he or she is medically released. This contrasts with the situation in the United States, where they have modified duty for injured soldiers. So, for instance, if a battlefield soldier in the United States were to lose a leg in combat and be unable to perform the usual duties, that soldier could perform other duties in the military, could still be in the military and be a clerk or air traffic controller, whatever would suit their requirements. In Canada there is no such modified duty. If soldiers can't deploy in any capacity, they're released and they become veterans.
What is the status of that in France? Is there a modified duty such that someone who's injured and cannot perform all duties can still serve in the military in a non-combat role?
Project Director to the Executive Director, Office national des anciens combattants et victimes de guerre, ministère des Armées
Earlier, we were talking about the esprit de corps, something that translates in France as well. The armed forces, particularly the army, are trying to keep in their units people who have been wounded, either in uniform or in civvies. This is a relatively common practice in the French armed forces. It is a very concrete example of the esprit de corps. The armed forces do not abandon soldiers who have been wounded while serving.
