Veterans Affairs Committee on Feb. 13th, 2018

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Do you believe the money that's there right now is adequate to serve the needs?

[Cmdre Sean Cantelon]

In regard to the program design, it's important to understand MFRCs vary across the country in terms of services they deliver. It is filling a known gap that was identified going into the policy review—so the application there.

There is always more to be done. The second part of the “more to be done” will be captured under the comprehensive military family plan where we will identify other needs. Some of those needs may be better done through a national program or tailored to a local area such as an employment thing that may be related to a provincial jurisdiction issue.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Speaking to that, does the MFS provide direction to MFRCs on how to use the spending directly?

[Cmdre Sean Cantelon]

Yes. The entire military family resource program is governed by orders in council as to how the money is to be allocated. We provide guidance to them, and we do oversight on behalf of DND and the defence ministers to the program being delivered for those outcomes. There are additional programs that their individual boards may choose to offer. We will provide them advice in those cases, but not oversight.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Some OUTCAN families are not covered under MFS Europe. How do you contact and provide services to those families?

[Col C.D. Harris]

We actually do have military family service centres, which are operated from the staff of the non-public funds, Commodore Cantelon's other hat. They are not under the same governance framework that the MFRCs are in Canada, but they do have outreach programs that are for the outlying regions in Europe. We have three centres in Europe itself, and they use outreach programs to go to the other centres. It's the same with the United States, for example.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Does the MFS have any presence in provincial entities like departments of education or health to help ease the transition of military families who are moving from one province to another?

[Cmdre Sean Cantelon]

We don't have that at present. We have a national manager who works interprovincial relationships, and we're looking to expand that capacity going forward. We have those relationships with the provinces.

There is one exception to that, which is our schools in Europe that we run. They are certified under the Ottawa-Carleton District School Board, and that relationship is a formalized one with the Ottawa-Carleton District School Board. So our guidance counselling service that we use operates under the Ottawa-Carleton District School Board, and then leverages the network across the country.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Right, thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Mr. Fraser, you have four minutes.

[Colin Fraser, Liberal, West Nova, NS]

Thank you both for being here. I'm glad that you're here to discuss the military family resource centres. Obviously, it is very important that they now have opened up all 32 to veterans and their families.

I represent West Nova, which has 14 Wing Greenwood. I know the great work that the military family resource centre does there on a daily basis with the entire military community, and also now with veterans.

It's extremely important that family members be engaged in the process of transition. When we had retired General Roméo Dallaire before our committee for another study, he highlighted this point in an extremely impactful way to say that this is necessary and critical to ensure that those families feel that they are part of the process. The military family resource centres do a great job of that outreach and engagement.

I wonder if you can now talk about how the MFRCs are available to all veterans and their families across the country. What level of engagement and awareness will take place to ensure that those who are eligible actually are going to come in and receive the services that will help them?

[Col C.D. Harris]

I appreciate your comments. It is not simply, for example, just opening up the doors of the MFRC and then all of a sudden our veterans and their families can come in and take advantage of the programs that were already offered. There are fundamental differences between the military family services program that we have now and the VAC-sponsored veteran family program.

For example, our whole program is built on the three unique characteristics of military lifestyle that families endure: frequent geographical relocations; extensive separation from families; and the risk of the profession of arms, which can result in illness, injury, or death. The program is built to help the families of Canadian Armed Forces members adjust to those living conditions as they're going across Canada.

Also, note the difference in the programs. For example, the CAF member, as you know, is looked after by the Canadian Armed Forces. All of a sudden, when you take off your uniform, you don't have that care from the Canadian Armed Forces. Under the veteran family program, the veteran and the family are now included. There's a distinct difference between the MFSP and the veteran family program.

As you can see, it is now totally turned opposite. A veteran and their family no longer have geographical relocations; in fact, they're permanently located in the community wherever they may live, and we don't know that at once when they're retiring. They don't have extended absences from their family, and that, of course, can have its own issues in many cases. Thirdly, not only do they not have a risky profession anymore, they have the whole culture shock of taking off the uniform.

The veteran family program is really geared to integrating a veteran and their family into the new life that they're going to be experiencing, into their community permanently. That's going to involve all kinds of community partnerships and we're going to have to educate and inform the community of what they're receiving for the ill and injured veteran and their family.

First of all, we have to recognize that the family has its own transition. It's not necessarily always linked to the member. We have to think about the families. We plan on doing that, but specifically to answer your question, we need to link up with the releasing member and their family immediately, because all the ill and injured are posted to the IPSCs, the integrated personnel support centres. We need to get linked up, right at that starting point, as soon as a member releases as an ill and injured member. We have to continue that process straight through with the family. We do have family liaison officers under the military family services program who are integrated into the IPSCs, so they will be able to start the comprehensive analysis of the needs of the family.

The beauty of the veteran family program is that it's tailored for the specific needs of the family. It's not a matter of you coming in and taking one of these and one of those. It's “What do you need?”, and we will develop a program for you to meet those needs.

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Great. Thank you.

Mr. Bratina, please. You have four minutes.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Thanks so much. This is a really interesting topic.

I'm curious about releasing members, because in my family, my sister worked her career and retired happily. Others suddenly found that they were no longer able to function as military personnel with the taking off of the uniform.

At what point in the releasing is there an interview process that determines how the member is feeling about their situation and whether it may lead to problems?

[Cmdre Sean Cantelon]

The veteran family part is what Colonel Harris has touched on. The entire goal here is to bring the family in, or meet them at a location that's comfortable for them, and do exactly that, talk through their needs and their expectations.

Specific to the Canadian Armed Forces and the serving member, there is also a process and interviews there. Really, I'm a bit ahead of next week's witness. I have the right week this time with General Misener, and that's part of that as well in terms of what they are trying to achieve. That's part of what they do: holistically, what do you need in terms of rehabilitation or vocation? Prior to release, ideally we're dealing with this in terms of looking for another activity for them to do, preferably with an occupational transfer to a different trade in the Canadian Forces and how that would go through.

It's the same type of family services. As you can imagine, in this case, the good news is that it's not a universality of service, or we've modified that policy so it's more flexible.

Let's use the air traffic controller example. If you're an infanteer in Petawawa....

That's a bad example. There is an aircraft tower in Petawawa. There are aircraft there.

I'll put you in Gagetown, where there's no permanently deployed squadron. You want to go work in Greenwood, so we're going to need to transition you to Borden for training and all of that. Your family is going to need those services. That's exactly where we would bring you in to provide those service supports through our integrated process, through the existing military family services program.

Yes, there's an interview. Yes, there's one for the families. General Misener can speak more specifically to the Canadian Armed Forces for the serving member, but that's exactly the point of this program.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Is there a format or template with how these centres are designed and set up? What do they look like in Trenton or Esquimalt and so on, an office in a strip mall?

[Cmdre Sean Cantelon]

Yes, there is a macro framework, which is what Colonel Harris touched on earlier. The military family services program sets out parameters that the family resource centres are to provide support. He touched on some of those points, and that's certainly available on the web or we can provide further details to the clerk.

The actual infrastructure varies across the country. It is a public responsibility to provide the infrastructure. It varies from base to base and based upon when they were last recapitalized. Some of those infrastructures will include things such as child care. Some of the MFRCs have branched out and also met through community services. It does vary.

An example I'll use is Petawawa; it has partnered with the local school board to provide child care services. In Ottawa, it's just done as a drop-in centre here. It varies across the country.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

The reason I'm asking is that I want to get a sense of the dignity of attending the centre from the released member's point of view, that it's properly done and well done in the sense that it gives somebody assurance.

[Cmdre Sean Cantelon]

I can personally testify to the committee that, when I visit every base, I sit with the executive director of the MFRC, and ideally with the chair, and we talk through these very issues. If there is a consistent theme, it is preferential for social services to be provided through the same access point as every other service, so there's no risk of stigmatization. Even though we work very hard to destigmatize that, the goal is that you have one general welcoming entrance and then when you go into the facility, you can go off to either meeting with family services or whatever, and that's the best outcome. That is the goal everyone tries to achieve.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Thanks very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Mr. Kitchen, you have four minutes.

[Robert Gordon Kitchen, Conservative, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

Thank you, Commodore and Colonel, for being here.

I might add on to the air traffic controller situation that my nephew just graduated last year as an air traffic controller in Moose Jaw. I'd be able to answer, hopefully, if he ever asked me the question of how he might transition to other parts of Canada and where he might go. Maybe I can at least refer to some of your comments today. I appreciate that.

As I've said before, I spent my life growing up in a military family and travelled quite a bit. Although I was a base rat for many years, my dad was posted overseas many times. We would transition through Lahr and knew the issues, when we were in Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iran, or England, when we would transition. The Lahr base is not there anymore. I'm glad to hear that there are three places....

What about other jurisdictions around the world where we deploy our soldiers as they transition out of their last posting? For example, if someone wants to take a posting in the Congo in his last UN posting and then would be transitioning out of that as his last post, can you walk us through how that might happen?

[Cmdre Sean Cantelon]

There is a nuanced difference between someone on an operational deployment such as a UN mission—deploying from a home unit and coming back to home and transitioning from that unit—and someone posted overseas.

First of all, posting overseas has to go through a screening program, to which anyone who has any complex issues like health care or child education would not go. An example might be attachés in an embassy overseas who would be at distance. They would access their release process the same as a healthy transitioning member—if I can use that term, non-medically injured transitioning member—as they come back.

In many cases, they will be posted back to their intended place of release, so that's that last posting, which may be back to where they were before or may be to a new geographic location. They'll be supported by the closest regional unit. From a family services perspective, we will support them through the national program as they identify and through the closest regional office. If you're in Europe or the United States, we have offices there. If you're the Canadian attaché to Chile, we'll support you through Ottawa.

[Robert Gordon Kitchen, Conservative, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

I recall when we came back from Pakistan, the NDHQ and the hospital, NDMC, were here and we went through that process, etc. Mental health issues weren't necessarily looked at as much as they are today.

As we deal with these issues today with our families, and we're looking at families now, the world is a different place. Families are different. There are a lot of issues. Divorce rates are much higher. How do we look at that aspect and how does the military identify that situation to help as that family is transitioning? In the military, as we've talked about a number of times in this committee, there's an attitude oftentimes where the soldier keeps that internally, does not share that with the spouse or to the children.

How do they access that and make certain they're looked after from a family point of view, especially when there's turmoil such as a divorce situation that might be occurring?

[Cmdre Sean Cantelon]

In military family centres outside of Canada.... In Europe, for instance, in Geilenkirchen, we have a social worker on staff to provide support. They have access to that as well. Notwithstanding that they pre-screen, things happen in life, so this resource is there to provide support.

The larger piece underlying this is destigmatization. When you get out, ask for help. If you're having a bad day, don't say it's okay; say that you're having some challenges, and we'll work together.

It's a two-pronged approach. It's a culture shift, and we are providing those services to support the families outside of Canada, in that specific example.