Veterans Affairs Committee on March 1st, 2018

[Col Sylvain Maurais]

With the new defence policy—“Strong, Secure, Engaged”—there's a big initiative to have a total health and wellness strategy, which is a comprehensive approach to looking at health in all the dimensions that you have stated. It is very encouraging to see how the leadership of the department and the Canadian Armed Forces are taking extremely seriously how we can improve to have better care and support.

For us in the chaplaincy, it's very interesting to see that not only is there a focus on physical health but there's much more awareness now about the complexity of the issues of mental health, and a holistic approach is also developing. Again, I want to say thanks for the research.

What do we mean by the spiritual dimension in this?

It's going to take time to go there, but there's really serious investment being made to improve and to be more proactive not only in the assessment but also in prevention and promotion in order to have better care and support.

[Emmanuella Lambropoulos, Liberal, Saint-Laurent, QC]

Thank you.

Another question that I have. You had mentioned that families prefer receiving information directly from VAC and not through the veteran. I was wondering if there had been any modifications to the way that VAC works in order to improve this transfer of information to families.

[Faith McIntyre]

I'll just add very briefly to what Colonel Maurais said. I believe you heard from Brigadier-General Misener at one of the conversations and as a witness. We're very much working collectively and collaboratively to enhance transition services moving forward, partnering from the start, whatever that start may be, depending on the needs of the individuals, so that the word “seamless” actually means something.

In terms of your question, we have to be very cognizant of the family unit, and certainly every family unit is different. I think the fact that we have an advisory group on families.... They are very strong spokespeople for their particular organizations and what their needs are. We need to be able to communicate, and we have been directly through that as one avenue. Then also, when we do provide information to veterans, it's to ensure that the family is engaged, that the family members know they can be present, that the family has a role through the expansion of the services through the military family services program.

One of the recommendations of the advisory group on families was to have that now moving forward for all medically releasing and to have that point right there where they can go and get information. Certainly within Veterans Affairs Canada, we are very open. Our staff believe in engagement across the family unit and in the multidisciplinary approach as well when it comes to all of the integration of services.

[Emmanuella Lambropoulos, Liberal, Saint-Laurent, QC]

How much time do I have, Chair?

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

You have a minute and a half.

[Emmanuella Lambropoulos, Liberal, Saint-Laurent, QC]

Last but not least, you spoke about an advisory group led by Jenny Migneault. Can you be more specific about the policy development that it helps inform?

[Faith McIntyre]

Definitely, and I could go on about this, so I will try to be brief. I know that Jenny did speak to you.

I spoke to you a moment ago about their three themes: recognize and compensate, inform and engage, and serve and support. I'll start off by saying that we're certainly on the right path, but when it comes to family, there's still a lot more to do. Part of it is that there is evidence that we need to continue to gather. Canada has not been very strong in gathering the evidence on this particular population, hence that's why we're here today and certainly reinforcing that. I will give you three examples, one under each theme, where this advisory group has a very clear impact.

Under recognize and compensate, there's the caregiver recognition benefit, which I know Jenny spoke about. Again, it's a start, but I know that it is the first time that Veterans Affairs Canada will be providing, as of April 2, 2018, a benefit directly to the caregiver: a monthly non-taxable $1,000. That's in direct correlation to what they wanted to see and, of course, is a start for where we need to go.

On informing and engaging, as Robert mentioned in his opening remarks, we have contracted with Saint Elizabeth Health Care for an online caregiver module called the “Caregiver Zone”, which will be released shortly. It is the first of its kind. It's building on a model in the United States that is called “Building Better Caregivers”. Our advisory groups on families were engaged in the development of the content of that module. One of the very particular pieces of this module is the fact that coaches who have had military cultural training and sensitivity awareness as well will be available to speak to caregivers.

Finally, under the serve-and-support theme, there is the reference we've made more than once, I think, for various witnesses in terms of the military family services program and the fact that program needed to be broadened to include veterans. We did so. Medically released veterans will have access as of April 1, 2018.

Those are just a few examples.

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Mr. Bratina.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Thank you.

First of all, Ms. Dursun and Ms. Skomorovsky, it sounded like the cohort numbers involved in the research were a little on the small side. Usually if we're doing a survey on politicians, you need to hear from 1,000 people or whatever. The polling is a little different, but nevertheless, are you satisfied that the cohorts you used were providing you with sufficient information? Would you like to make these groups larger? Is it a question of resources? What would you say on the numbers?

[Dr. Sanela Dursun]

For the study I mentioned, the transition and well-being survey was administered to 1,000 people who were medically released and 1,000 who were non-medically released. From a scientific point of view, those are sufficient numbers. We received a 70% response rate. Those will be sufficient numbers to provide us with population estimates.

This is the first large quantitative study focusing on the ill and injured—and on their spouses—while they are transitioning. This whole area of research is relatively new. Only recently we started recognizing the challenges of the transitioning process and started focusing on medical release, which is also consequential to the increase in medical releases in the past five years.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Right.

[Dr. Sanela Dursun]

Some of the studies that were conducted and that my colleague was talking about were at first exploratory studies, where we needed to do a small pilot study with 150 people in order to develop the instruments before investing in a larger study.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

We heard one good outcome. What would you say to the translating results into policy recommendations? Is that working well?

[Dr. Sanela Dursun]

Absolutely. In our organization, our research is very client focused, in such a way that every initiative produces recommendations that are directly communicated to our clients. When I say “clients”, these are the people in the Department of National Defence responsible for the policies, services, and programs.

For example, our very first study of ill and injured people conducted in 2012 with the participants in RTW programs under the JPSU umbrella gave us the first indication of the role of the spouses and the families in the recovery and rehabilitation of these ill and injured members. That initiated many discussions and definitely informed the decision-making, which ultimately led to opening MFRCs for these types of families.

We have many examples to show how our research informs the decision-making and influences the policies and programs.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Very good.

Ms. McIntyre, you mentioned RCMP. We talk about veterans and we typically think of the military services. RCMP can find themselves in unique situations, two-person postings in remote areas, the needs of indigenous communities around them. They might be quite different than, say, a military posting in Afghanistan or whatever.

Does the RCMP experience come up in the work that you do?

[Faith McIntyre]

I would say yes. I think you're aware that the RCMP, through their superannuation act, receive benefits through an agreement with Veterans Affairs Canada under the Pension Act.

Having said that, though, they are represented on each one of our six ministerial advisory groups. For example, with regard to the advisory group on families, we have a representative of the RCMP Veterans' Association who speaks very openly and actively about the situation of RCMP families. Despite the differences in context, it is still very similar in the way that family support is critical to well-being.

As well, we have an RCMP liaison officer who works full time at Veterans Affairs Canada and is integrated into all of our policy committees, our operational work, and service delivery.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

I'm an RCMP family, so I know exactly what you're talking about.

Colonel Maurais, on the question of chaplaincy, we heard testimony earlier that chaplains are experiencing PTSD for the reason that the stigmatization of soldiers means they quite often can't share problems with anyone except perhaps their immediate family or the chaplain.

Are the chaplains being looked after?

[Col Sylvain Maurais]

Yes, sir.

A third pillar for our service is that we are there to empower and care for those who are called to serve. We have built, for years, in partnership with the Canadian Forces health services, a care for the caregivers program. I can testify that it has saved some chaplains' lives after operational deployment, either in Somalia or Rwanda or you name it. That program carries on.

I have some of my brothers and sisters in chaplaincy who have been diagnosed with PTSD. They've been released medically. The level of care and support they have received—I cannot comment for all the cases—has been very good.

However, it's very demanding. We are in a dangerous business. The risk of compassion fatigue is real. Vicarious traumatization is something that can haunt us. We are developing programs right now for vocational renewal for chaplains to be able to remain healthy and balanced in what we're called to do.

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Mr. Kitchen.

[Robert Gordon Kitchen, Conservative, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you all for being here today and giving us an opportunity to ask some questions.

I've done an awful lot of writing and have many questions for all of you, but I don't think I'll have time for everything.

I am the product of a military family, so I'm grateful to hear the comments you make about the military family. I also am the grandson of a Baptist missionary, and my father served throughout the country. I remember when my father was the CO of the RCD in Gagetown. I was younger—that was only a few years ago—

[An hon. member]

Are you sure?

[Robert Gordon Kitchen, Conservative, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

—and I remember on the base we would go every Sunday to church. I was too young; I used to enjoy it because it was a chance to get out on Sunday and throw darts in the mess. I've grown up a lot since then and learned a lot more of the value of what I learned in those times.

Colonel, your comments are right on, because a lot of what you talk about is respect. It's respect for the job that our soldiers do, but also respect for life. Your job is a big challenge: to try to be there for them to support them. I want to roll that into the concept of this idea. We talk about respect for our families, and we talk about respect for our soldiers, but the soldiers, airmen, and seamen need to know that someone has their back. That respect comes with knowing there's confidence in that person and in the job they do. Believing in something is of tremendous value. Whether someone believes in whatever, it doesn't matter to me. The reality is the belief of our soldiers, who become our veterans, that the military would be there for them.

We're studying transition, and we're studying it again and again and again. I don't believe our veterans see that respect, because they aren't getting the benefits, and things are not changing. We're studying the same things that we studied weeks ago, months ago, years ago, and we haven't implemented those things.

I'm just wondering if you can comment, sir, on how we can enforce that respect.

[Col Sylvain Maurais]

First I have to say, in all my years of service, the very great majority of the people who have been called to serve are very good leaders. Enforcing respect is modelled the way of sound leadership, and that's something that, if we don't give the example, then it's not going to happen.

The other thing is professional development, training, and education. One of the things that I've seen is the complexity of the profession of arms, sir. Soldiers have to learn so many things right now, because it's very technical and it's very complex, so the time they have for self-reflection could be compressed because of the many things they have to learn, but now there's a realization that there's more training for the defence ethics that needs to happen for moral development, and there is a realization that the padres have to bring a spiritual dimension of what the moral development is.

Also, I have to say that the young people we're recruiting are a product of the values of our society. They have a bit of culture shock when they come to us with the high expectations of the values the profession of arms demands, and we need to really push them.

[Robert Gordon Kitchen, Conservative, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

So supporting that emphasis is extremely important—

[Col Sylvain Maurais]

Yes.