Evidence of meeting #78 for Veterans Affairs in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was family.
A recording is available from Parliament.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Robert Gordon Kitchen Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
—not only for our soldiers, but also for our families.
12:15 p.m.
Col Sylvain Maurais
Absolutely.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Robert Gordon Kitchen Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
We train our soldiers from the day they come in, but we don't train them from the moment they go out. That's where we come to that transition. We train our soldiers, but we don't train our families to be part of the soldier life. I grew up in a sailor family. My brother served, my sister served, and my nephew serves—I have three nephews. It's part of the system. It's part of who they are. How do we get that information to families and include them throughout the whole process? As you've said, a lot of them don't know about what services are available to them once that soldier transitions out. They don't know, because maybe the soldier was so busy learning everything they needed to learn they didn't have the time to do it. We need to get that to them. How do we put the emphasis on that?
12:15 p.m.
Director of Field Operations, Strategic Affairs, Department of Veterans Affairs
Absolutely, that is an ongoing challenge to ensure that the families are included in the work we do. An example of what has been done concretely and, you know, still needs to be improved, is the VAC employee or the case manager from Veterans Affairs, as well as a veterans service agent, being in the IPSCs, working side by side with CAF, with military members who are not even released, at that point try to engage the family as well as the member.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Robert Gordon Kitchen Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
Do you think you can maybe see that this is coming from my heart?
12:15 p.m.
Director of Field Operations, Strategic Affairs, Department of Veterans Affairs
Sure, absolutely.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Robert Gordon Kitchen Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK
We've got soldiers and families out there who have that, and they're not getting....
How do we get that to the people who are putting those services in place to understand it the way I do, so that they can push for it to say this has to be done?
12:15 p.m.
Liberal
12:15 p.m.
Director of Field Operations, Strategic Affairs, Department of Veterans Affairs
It's a very complex question. Certainly from my perspective—I'm a social worker, most of our staff are social workers—we approach the veteran as a member of a system. We never see the individual, but we see a person within a system. We're always, from our perspective, philosophically, approaching it as a systemic....
Now, there are limits. The member may not want the family to be involved. We do confront that, unfortunately. We strongly encourage members to include their spouses and husbands in the transition process. There are times, however, when the member chooses not too. Unfortunately, we have to respect that. We continue to urge the member to include or at least make sure the family is involved.
I'm not sure if that responds to your point, but I certainly can appreciate your passion. It is a very difficult question. There's no doubt.
12:15 p.m.
Liberal
Colin Fraser Liberal West Nova, NS
Thank you, Chair.
Thank you very much to all of you for being here today and assisting us in our study on barriers to transition. I know that most of my colleagues appreciate very much being able to ask you really pertinent questions to our study so that we can draw out the best information and make proper recommendations. We appreciate your being here.
I have one question for you, Dr. Skomorovsky.
You said in your presentation that one of the themes that has developed already in the research that your study is undertaking is the theme of difficulty for transitioning members or medically releasing members in finding family doctors. I wonder if you could flesh that out for us a little bit so we understand.
Is that an issue that's systemic for all Canadians, or is it because there are specific barriers when these veterans are transitioning that make it difficult for them to obtain a family doctor? That is a very crucial piece to stable family life and ensuring that successful transition.
I'm wondering if you could comment on that.
12:20 p.m.
Department of National Defence
When a military member was in the system they had a doctor in the system. Now it's a very new experience for the transitioning member and veteran. To find a doctor sometimes it may be a new location for them. They are not familiar how to find a family doctor. It is something they need to do also while transitioning, while they are finding their place in life and having changes in other areas so it's an additional stressor for them. It may be a unique situation for them that they need to do it in parallel this searching for other things. Sometimes another job, sometimes finding an education. It may be an additional stressor for them that may be uniquely different. In general, it may be problematic for every person to find a family doctor. For military members and veterans is may be a little more difficult because they need to do it rapidly while having many other changes in their life.
12:20 p.m.
Liberal
Colin Fraser Liberal West Nova, NS
Ideally having these things in place before being released would be beneficial to that transition.
12:20 p.m.
Department of National Defence
Yes.
And sometimes they do it and realize is, and sometimes they don't.
12:20 p.m.
Liberal
Colin Fraser Liberal West Nova, NS
Col Maurais, thank you very much for being here. I really appreciate the informative and passionate statement that you made. It really was important to show the work you do in the spiritual domain.
I'm wondering what we can do as a committee to make a recommendation to help support you and the important work that chaplains do in our Canadian Forces to assist veterans as they're transitioning. Is there something you think you can specifically recommend to the government that would assist you in your work?
12:20 p.m.
Col Sylvain Maurais
Pray for us? No.
12:20 p.m.
Some hon. members
Oh, oh!
12:20 p.m.
Col Sylvain Maurais
We have some challenges right now in recruiting, because it is a priority of the chaplain general for us to be able to sustain the recruiting, and we want to keep fostering diversity, to have more women within the chaplaincy. I failed to mention, in terms of diversity, that we have a full-time indigenous advisor at the office of the chaplain general, who is doing fantastic work. For us diversity is not only for all the world religions that are outside, but the spiritual and religious diversity we have here at home, with the richness of the indigenous spiritual outlook and practices. Recruiting is an issue in that sense.
Another thing we have identified as a strategic priority for us is our chaplain school that we have in Borden. It provides excellent training in ethics, counselling, religious pluralism, and also for what the chaplains can bring in terms of analysis on religious area assessment and religious leaders' engagement in theatres of operation.
We're asking to say that the school will be a gem for chaplain training because we have chaplains coming from all over the world to see how we do business, because we are unique for being fully integrated with the three arms and the environment and working so well and so peacefully with a diversity of beliefs as well as honouring non-believers. We're unique in the world.
We're also asking to be able to say that the chaplain school will provide training and education not only for chaplains, but to become the centre of excellence for the whole of the Canadian Armed Forces on moral and spiritual development. We have asked for more resources to do this, but it takes some time to get this.
12:20 p.m.
Liberal
Colin Fraser Liberal West Nova, NS
In your work and the work of other chaplains, is there any extra outreach or emphasis placed on that transition phase, where veterans could be facing more difficulty in handling the stresses?
12:25 p.m.
Col Sylvain Maurais
Yes. The chaplains are fully engaged in the great new initiative on transition, where we want to be as effective as possible to help people make the transition from active service to civilian life, the same way we have the departure assistance group when we are preparing people to deploy. A trial run is going to happen very quickly for a comprehensive approach whereby we can best support people in transition. Chaplains have a key role in this, because people can talk to us and we can tell their stories.
12:25 p.m.
Conservative
Phil McColeman Conservative Brantford—Brant, ON
Thank you, Chair.
Mr. Cormier, I asked you earlier about the statistics you said you kept about all the channels where you connect with veterans. I don't think I asked earlier: can we have you submit those to the committee, please? Can we have them in detail, by location and/or however you keep them? I don't know if you keep them on a monthly basis or an annual basis, but in as much detail as possible.
Chair, I'd like to yield the rest of my time to Mr. Clarke.
12:25 p.m.
Conservative
Alupa Clarke Conservative Beauport—Limoilou, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Hello, everyone. I am pleased to be meeting you today.
Colonel Maurais, I too was very impressed by what you said. In today's secular society, we rarely talk about the spiritual aspect and the need for all individuals to believe or not believe. I liked what you said about also serving non-believers. I myself served in the army, where I met other young people who did not believe in anything in particular, but what we did all believe in was loving and serving our country, and I think that is fantastic. Thank you so much for what you are doing.
By the by, I just want to mention that the chaplain of the 6th Field Artillery Regiment is a great chaplain.
Ms. McIntyre, I sat on the committee in 2015 and 2016. Even back then, we were already studying all the obstacles that Canadian Armed Forces members face in transitioning to civilian life. Both the national defence ombudsman and the veterans ombudsman told us it was time to take action and stop carrying out studies on this issue.
Given all your years of experience in this field, Ms. McIntyre, why do you think we are still having trouble eliminating transition barriers? We can assume it is not merely, or necessarily, a question of public policy or money. If that is indeed the case, and it is not a question of public policy, money, or respect, what is it? What is still blocking the way today? Why can't we ensure a harmonious transition?
12:25 p.m.
Director General, Policy and Research Division, Strategic Policy and Commemoration, Department of Veterans Affairs
Thank you very much for the question. I think that question is central to everything you do, to your reports and the recommendations you want to present.
As we said, it's clear that efforts are being made. It's important to remember that there is a lot of work involved in a transition. There are transition or return-to-work interviews to be conducted in collaboration with the Canadian Armed Forces. All that is being done.
I think we need to take a close look at the culture aspect. What I mean is that as soon as an individual joins the army, we already need to be thinking about when that individual leaves. A career does not just last for the soldier's military service. It spans their entire lifetime. Sooner or later, the soldier will complete their military service and have to transition back to civilian life.
That is one way of thinking. We are getting there now. We need to be able to put all the systems in place to support that culture and that way of thinking.
