Veterans Affairs Committee on Feb. 1st, 2021

[Harold Davis]

Thank you, sir.

COVID is having a big effect on a lot of them. During Christmas, for example, I was talking to three different veterans who because of COVID can't go out anymore. They have PTSD, high anxiety, and I'm trying to talk them off the ledge. That's where my Christmas was this year. COVID for my group of people, or veterans I should say, is affecting them, but in so many different ways. I have some guys who are watching every penny, I have some guys who are having a hard time just going out to get groceries if they can, or if they have to carry them in. I have other people who are having a hard time with some of their claims in trying to get through VAC before they have to make major decisions.

[John Brassard, Conservative, Barrie—Innisfil, ON]

I know you and I have talked about that, and there's been a lot of movement in the United States with Veterans Affairs and other veterans government agencies around the world recognizing some of those claims. I know we only have about 45 seconds, so maybe talk to the difficulty in Persian Gulf Veterans getting their claims.

[Harold Davis]

To start with, Gulf War illness is not recognized by VAC. In many other countries it's starting, especially in the U.S. I keep sending the information and it's not really doing what it should be doing. The VAC sticks to its guns and says that it doesn't really exist. VAC treats individual ailments and that's great, but when you're talking to veterans who have been suffering for 30 years, the individual ailments now all roll into one ailment and they're having a really hard time with it. It's so hard for them to turn around and speak to anybody. Most of the people at VAC haven't got a clue because the Gulf War was over 30 years ago. Most of the Persian Gulf veterans have almost been forgotten on the world stage and within Canada itself. VAC tries to help in the ways it can help, but it is still falling short of what it can do for us.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Thank you very much.

Now we go for five minutes to MP Casey please.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I'm going to be directing my questions to the Multifaith Housing Initiative, but before I do, Mr. Thorne, this is my second tour of duty on this committee. When I was first on the committee in 2011 and 2012 we had the privilege of travelling and we visited the Veterans Transition Network. I got to meet Dr. Westwood and Mr. Laidler. In fact, as I open your web page, I see a photograph of our visit to your facility there with a couple of my colleagues who are no longer with us.

I remember at the time remarking how incredible the work was that was being done, and not only that but how scalable it was. I want to congratulate you, not having followed your organization in between, for the remarkable progress that you made. As I say, I'm going to address my questions to Ms. Le, but I have great admiration having seen what it came from and where you are now. If I get a chance to come back to you, I will.

Ms. Le, thank you very much for the work that you do and your presentation here today, and congratulations on the opening of the Veterans' House, I would say against pretty substantial odds. You talked about the support that you had been given in order for that to happen; I think you said $6.5 million. I know that there is other funding available under the national housing strategy. Through the programs that are within your organization, have you been part of an application under the rapid housing initiative perchance? It seems to me that would be the sort of thing that would be aligned with the work you do.

[Suzanne Le]

The $6.5 million did come under the national housing strategy, under the co-investment fund run by CMHC. The rapid housing money had very specific rules and timelines around it, and one of those rules was it could not be an already funded project. Veterans' House was automatically excluded from rapid housing money.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Were you able to access the Canada emergency wage subsidy to cover some of the salaries through the pandemic?

[Suzanne Le]

We were able to access a very small amount, 10%, not 25%. Fundraised money doesn't necessarily count as income, so it makes it a little difficult when your organization is based on fundraising.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

You talked about wraparound supports. Can you talk a little more about that and whether there is a partnership with the federal government in connection with the delivery of those supports?

[Suzanne Le]

Veterans Affairs Canada has agreed to provide us with caseworker support for our tenants in the building. I'm going to give kudos here and a very happy wave to my Legion friends in front of me and my co-witnesses, because the Legion has come forward with $100,000 a year to pay for the full-time mental health support worker in the building. That has been fantastic, to know we have that money and the mental health support worker. We also have the Legion doing work one on one with the tenants to help them make sure they're connected with all the services available to them through Veterans Affairs and make sure they get their Veterans Affairs card.

We have a group called Soldiers Helping Soldiers, serving military people, boots on the ground, and they will.... General Stu Beare is one of their patrons, so it might be known to some of you. They're going to be doing a peer mentoring service program for the tenants. As I said, we will have people in uniform in the building.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you, Ms. Le.

Mr. Thorne, you talked about the $200,000 you received under the veterans organizations emergency support fund, and you said that the application experience was smooth. That runs counter to some of the other testimony we've heard. Can you elaborate a bit on that?

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Be Very brief, please.

[Oliver Thorne]

Yes, absolutely.

I think I can elaborate. The experience was smooth compared to a lot of other applications, in particular, the ECSF. The advantage we have as an organization is that we have a dedicated grant writer and professional fundraiser. From our perspective as an organization that does this professionally, it was a smooth, simple process, but I can understand for those that perhaps don't have those resources, don't have the experience grant writing, it could be a challenging process.

I know I have just a couple of seconds, but I wanted to thank you, Mr. Casey, for your comments and echo that the Veterans Transition Network would not exist were it not for the Legion. It has been an integral part of piloting, developing and supporting the program for 20 years, our longest-standing donor. As much as I'm here to talk about my organization's experience, I have to highlight that it would not exist without the bedrock foundation of the Legion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Thank you, Mr. Thorne.

Now we'll move over to MP Desilets for two and a half minutes, please.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Thorne, you alluded to the fact that you have received $200,000 in emergency funding.

Can you tell us whether that meets your needs? More is always wanted, but does that minimally meet your needs during this pandemic?

[Oliver Thorne]

Thank you for the question, Mr. Desilets.

It meets our needs for the first six months of 2021. We began the year in a good financial position. We are ready to provide programs across Canada over the next six months, and we intend to do so.

I will switch to English; I apologize.

We are prepared and we have the demand to deliver a full suite of programs across Canada for the next six months. If the financial sector does continue to contract, if there is less money available, the CEWS is about to end, large funding organizations are telling us less money is going to be available in the next year and all our Veterans Affairs funding has effectively been cut.

If nothing on that front changes within the next six months, we will be in a very challenging position. We have the ability to forge ahead and deliver these programs because we're being asked to do so by veterans and we're going to do that, but we are going to have to reinvent ourselves and our financial situation again this year, as we did last year.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you.

I have a quick question for Mr. Davis and Mr. Wilkins.

How did the government set the funding level at $14 million? Why did it not set it at $20 million, for example, or a lower amount?

Before making this announcement, did the government consult you to find out what your needs are?

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

You each have about 10 seconds.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[Brian Wilkins]

As far as the Navy Club is concerned, we found out about it three days before the application had to be put in, so we didn't have any time to prepare for anything. There was absolutely no mention prior to three days before.

[Harold Davis]

I echo that.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

We will now go over to MP Blaney, please, for two and a half minutes.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Mr. Thorne, I'm going to come back to you.

You talked about—Mr. Brassard also asked you about this—the funding from VAC that's going to be cut. From what I understand from your initial presentation, a third of the seats that you host are covered by that. It sounds like that's been cut completely.

I'm just wondering if there was a clear warning and a rationale. Are you still considered a Veterans Affairs service provider?

How many folks will lose their seat?

I have another one because I have such a short period of time. I saw on your website that you do have a COVID tiered peer support program. I'm wondering if that has any support from VAC as well.

[Oliver Thorne]

Yes, typically we aim to have a third of the veterans attending our programs covered by Veterans Affairs.

I talked earlier about the reality of charitable organizations. It's very difficult to convince people to give you funding to fund your staff, your rent or your Internet connection. The way we function as an organization is that with a third of our clients being Veterans Affairs clients, that funding is unrestricted. We can use it for any purpose we need. Typically, that's the funding that we dedicate to pay for our staff and our overhead.

The remaining two-thirds allows us to tell all of our donors that this money is supporting veterans directly and it is not being spent on our overhead. That's why it's so important.

We received no warning. As far as I understand, we're still a Veterans Affairs service provider, but not for the program that we've designed to run specifically during COVID. That is obviously a challenge.

Again, for the next six months no veterans will lose their seats, but that will change if we cannot find an alternative funding source or fix this with Veterans Affairs in the next six months. We're going to steam ahead, but it puts us at risk.

Finally, the tiered peer support program is not supported by Veterans Affairs directly. It is funded through a partnership with the Centre of Excellence on PTSD. We're currently developing that and rolling that out this year.