Veterans Affairs Committee on April 28th, 2021

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. McLellan.

Mr. Loveridge, we are short on time, but I'd like your opinion with respect to overseas memorials compared to those chosen in Canada and Quebec.

Is there sufficient funding on both sides? Is there an area, overseas or in Canada, that is being left behind?

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Give a brief answer, please.

[David Loveridge]

My understanding is that the funding in Europe is sufficient to meet the requirements for the memorials in the short term. I have heard nobody say that there was not sufficient funding in Europe. I'm talking specifically about the VAC memorials that we care for under the commission.

In Canada we don't have a lot of memorials, but we do have more than 228,000 grave markers, which I think many of you may be aware were not being well maintained. That's why we're in this five-year project right now to care for the backlog.

I would hate to see us go back to the shortfall funding that we had prior to this project. Understanding what's required to maintain our grave markers, then, which are memorials here in Canada, would be very important going forward.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Thank you.

Up next we have MP Blaney for two and a half minutes.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Thank you.

I will come back to you, Mr. Loveridge.

Thank you for talking about all the work you're doing in terms of maintaining those gravesites. I think that's incredibly important. I'm wondering, with this backlog how long it is going to take to catch up, and what your ongoing concerns are moving forward. The other part of this—and I've heard this from other folks—is how are we including young people in seeing and participating? What is more meaningful than educating people by actually having them be there and understanding what it means when we talk about our history?

[David Loveridge]

Those are both really good questions.

We're in year three of addressing the entire backlog across Canada for the Veterans Affairs grave markers. We're making great progress, particularly in Ontario. We're getting them done and bringing them up to a standard that I think anyone who looks at them would think was acceptable. I think at the end of this period we'll be good. I would hate to see us go back to having a backlog again, so those are issues that we'll address going forward.

On the young people thing, I think Caroline has also talked a lot about the engagement program. We call the engagement program Eyes On, Hands On, and our plan is to start that program sometime in 2022-23. Through it we want to engage the youth, the Legion and the cadet corps. We want to do that kind of stuff first of all to help us maintain, care for and be “eyes on” to all of our markers across Canada but also to use it as an educational opportunity for those groups to understand veterans. That engagement and outreach are critical as we go forward, because our veterans, especially from the First World War and Second World War, are disappearing and disappearing quickly.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Thank you for that. I really appreciate that.

I know I don't have a lot of time for a really meaningful next question, but I think this is the important factor, that education. Often, it's those hands-on opportunities that help us pass on that knowledge, so I really appreciate that you're doing that work.

I'll leave the last few seconds I have to the next questioner.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Thank you.

Up next we have MP Davidson.

Go ahead, please, for five minutes.

[Scot Davidson, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thanks to the witnesses.

Thank you for the 12 seconds, MP Blaney.

Caroline, first, I want to say thank you. This is a picture. He kind of looks like me. That's my grandfather from 1914. He was at Vimy Ridge, hill 60, and I went to the War Museum one day and your people there helped me take this old negative and turn this into a photo so we could identify exactly almost to the day where that picture was taken, so I thank you for that and for all the work.

You know what? Since we're on the photo, it's always all about the riding. I would say to our Juno Beach Don that I'm proud to say Jim Parks is in my riding in Mount Albert. I thank you for that flag program you started. I didn't know anything about that flag program until Jim was doing a run this year, which I was proud to go out to support.

Anyway, there are a couple of things. In my riding is Chippewas of Georgina Island First Nation. They have a small cenotaph that's in need of some repair. This leads me to my first question. What are we doing with first nations people to show and teach the new generation the contributions they made to Canada in all our wars and all our conflicts?

I may interrupt because I have so many questions. Someone can go ahead with that, if they would.

Go ahead, Caroline.

[Caroline Dromaguet]

Thank you, Mr. Davidson.

That's a great picture and I'm glad we were helpful in getting it for you. That's also an excellent question.

In terms of first nations and indigenous stories, it's very top of mind and a priority for our institution. Of course, we have stories that are intertwined in our permanent galleries, but I can say that we have amplified that in the last few years. Our most recent and moving example was the donation of the portrait of Philip Favel, who was actually part of D-Day. We were able to commemorate him in a partnership event with DND last November, so his story is being told and secured. When we shared the photo, it actually went viral, so we see there is an interest and a need to tell those very important stories.

We're also involving indigenous stories and perspectives in our educational resources. When we're talking about supply line kits or some of our school programs, for instance, we are integrating those stories and talking about those important experiences and continuing our efforts to collect.

Perhaps I'll end by saying that more and more we recognize it's important that when we do speak about these experiences that it's done in consultation and that the voices that are heard are the voices of the people we represent. That is something we take really seriously and want to increase as we move forward.

[Scot Davidson, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

Thanks very much for that.

I have a Silver Cross mom who works for me—her son was killed in action in Afghanistan—and she was very disappointed by the Liberal government when they failed to invite them to the Afghan memorial unveiling. She got a letter two days after the unveiling. I want to know what we're doing currently to make sure things like that don't happen again and that they're always involved in the commemoration process.

When there's a commemoration process, is there going to be outreach especially to families, I would say, of those who have recently been killed in action? Is outreach going to take place?

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Who is the question going to?

[Scot Davidson, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

I'm asking anyone who's involved in commemoration, but I'll leave that. That was just an upsetting incident that took place.

That's something we have to look at: if there's going to be any commemorative unveilings like there was with the Afghanistan memorial that families are notified on that.

Second, I think—

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

It will have to be very quick, Scot.

[Scot Davidson, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

Okay.

With private sector involvement like Vintage Wings of Canada, Michael Potter's organization, is there more that we can do with the private sector?

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

We need a very brief answer, please.

Scot, who was that going to?

[Scot Davidson, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

I guess it would be to Caroline.

Everyone else I'm going to say is gun-shy. I don't want to use that word, but—

[Caroline Dromaguet]

Sure, I can jump in here.

We have partnered with institutions or private sector companies like Vintage Wings on several public programs. We're always open to receiving proposals, which we review, and if they fit and align with our mandate, we're more than happy to collaborate.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Thank you.

Now, for five minutes, we have MP Casey, please.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'd like to start with Ms. Bailey.

In your opening remarks, you made a reference to something I'd like you to elaborate on. It was around the budget that was handed down on Monday of last week, and a reference to the Parks Canada budget including funding for Canadian sites only.

Can you provide us with a little more detail on what the issue is there and what your advice would be as we consider the budget and the budget implementation act? If there's a problem, what is the problem, and what would you like us to do about it?

[Caitlin Bailey]

Absolutely. Thank you so much, Mr. Casey.

It wasn't really pointing out a problem specifically. It was more saying again that, for the European monuments, there's a kind of out of sight, out of mind mentality.

My colleague Mr. Loveridge mentioned that the budgets are adequate in the short term, and I think that's a good point. They are adequate in the short term, but I think we have to continue to think about the long term. We're thinking, okay, we have x amount here, which is allocated for improvement and maintenance of Canadian sites, but those are sites specifically in Canada. The budget does say that Parks Canada is getting...I can't remember the amount specifically, for the maintenance of its x number of sites in Canada.

The overseas sites are a partnership management system with the Commonwealth War Graves, as Mr. Loveridge mentioned. Parks is implicated and Veterans Affairs is implicated; there are private bodies like us implicated as well. The concern our organization has is, again, the long term, and trying to think about what happens when these sites need improvement.

The improvement budget right now says it's Canadian sites in Canada. That causes problems in the long term.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you.

Mr. Cooper, you indicated that 2019 was the best year ever for the Juno Beach Centre.

I'd be most interested in hearing from you about the impact of COVID and what it's going to mean for you going forward. What has been the impact of the pandemic and what do you anticipate the lasting effects will be?

[Don Cooper]

That's a great question. I was good at guessing at the beginning of the pandemic, but I'm getting fairly poor at looking down the road anymore.

It was a disaster from our point of view, in terms of revenues. Revenues went to zero, obviously, as we closed the museum. We were open for a few months last year, so I guess our revenues are down maybe 85% or something because we were open for a few months. That continued into this year. We haven't opened this year yet, and we don't know when we're going to open next. Our revenues are at zero.

I have to say that governments in France and in Canada have really stepped up. We've had salary support programs in France. We've had money that's basically contingency funding that they backed. In Canada, you know the programs. There were wage support programs, and we have special consideration from Veterans Affairs, so I think we're fine.

I think there's going to be a surge when things open up, so we'd be back to heavy visitor traffic. People are just trying to go out and visit. When we get our international travellers back, I think we'll be in good shape.

I'm very optimistic that in the long term things will settle back into normal and we can continue on our growth plan again.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you.

I have a very quick question for you, Mr. McLellan.

You indicated that you're in the process of getting your museum to national status. Where are you in that process? What steps are yet to be taken?

[Steve McLellan]

We are moving forward. It is not a process that has a playbook, so we are creating it with Canadian Heritage at the table. I would like to say that this process is moving at the speed of business or the speed that we would like, but it's not. It's a slow process, and while we have been referenced recently in the most recent budget—we're very appreciative of that, and the details of that are still to come—we're committed and we're very convinced that the story we're telling and the opportunities we have are important to Canada.

We will continue moving forward. We expect it will be a couple of years before we invite all of you to that opening ceremony though.