Veterans Affairs Committee on Feb. 13th, 2023

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Yes. Please go ahead, Mrs. Wagantall.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

I would like clarity on the amendment. When we say “medical information”, what medical information would identify a veteran, a specific veteran? I can't imagine any diagnosis or anything like that directly identifying a veteran.

What exactly are you referring to there, Mr. Casey?

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Most of the time, it's not the medication but the number of veterans involved. If there are a small number, they can be linked.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

It's not the medication only.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

The wording I've proposed indicates that any personal medical information should be removed from the transcript, so whatever is personal to the veteran should not be for public consumption.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

To clarify, what veterans have a problem with is not information about medical conditions being released but their name being released along with it, exposing their condition, which this motion clearly does not do.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

I can answer Mr. Casey's comments.

I am told that once the redacted documents are received, it is up to the committee to decide whether too much information has been removed from a document. However, if the committee decides that the document has to be reviewed and other information added, we can ask the law clerk and parliamentary counsel of the House of Commons to do this job so we can be given a proper document.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Can I ask Mr. Casey, through you, Chair, to repeat the amendment? I think I share the same sentiment that Mrs. Wagantall just indicated. I think medical information that would identify someone should, of course, be redacted, but if it's simply an indication of some kind of medical information that would not identify someone, I don't know that it's necessarily something that needs to be redacted.

Maybe you could repeat it and we could see if we could come to something that works for everybody here.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

The amendment is to delete all the words contained in parentheses and to add the following at the end of the motion: “furthermore, that Veterans Affairs Canada redact from the transcript any personal identifiable information of the veteran or Veterans Affairs Canada employees, and any personal medical information.”

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Are there any other interventions?

We have Mr. Richards and then Mrs. Wagantall.

Mr. Richards, go ahead, please.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

I think if we were to add words at the end of that along the lines of “and any personal medical information that would identify a veteran”, I think that would probably be within the spirit of what Mr. Casey's trying to suggest, and I think it would certainly make me feel more comfortable that we would not get a document that was so redacted that it wouldn't be useful to the committee.

That would be my suggestion, as a subamendment, I suppose, unless it's considered a friendly amendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Before I go to Mr. Casey for the friendly amendment, I have Mrs. Wagantall.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

At this point in time, I would agree with my colleague. Unless you can give me some idea of what that would be, it seems irrelevant here, because we are obviously talking about veterans who have gone for assistance because of needing programs and services based on their medical conditions. I don't see how this would identify them, but I would certainly agree with adding “information that would identify a veteran”. Then, hopefully, those who are doing the research.... We all want to see something positive come out of this for the sake of our veterans.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Mr. Casey.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

I really have nothing to add. There's no such thing as a friendly amendment. If my friend wants to offer a subamendment, it's within his power to do so. However, that's the amendment I've tabled; that's the amendment I would like us to vote on.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Okay. Great.

Mr. Richards.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

I'm just indicating that I am, then, in fact, moving it as a subamendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

This subamendment.... Can you read it or say what words...?

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Yes.

It would simply be to add at the end of the amendment “that would identify a veteran”.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Okay.

We have a subamendment on the floor.

Ms. Blaney, the floor is yours.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Thank you.

We're at 18 minutes. I think this is very interesting; I just think it's time to call the vote.

I move to call the vote. How's that?

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

That's perfect.

We'll vote, first of all, on the subamendment.

(Subamendment agreed to)

(Amendment as amended agreed to)

(Motion as amended agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Ladies and gentlemen, please forgive this hold‑up.

We were doing a six-minute round of questions. Given the time, we are going to offer only four minutes of speaking time for each speaker. Blake Richards had the floor.

Mr. Richards, you have already taken one minute of speaking time. You therefore have three minutes left to ask your questions.

Please go ahead.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Thank you.

I do apologize, again, for interrupting some of the time you would have been provided. We'll move as quickly as we can and get into some questions, so that we can get as much information from you as we can. I appreciate your presentations.

Probably the big thing I would like to touch on with both of you is that we heard a lot in the last few meetings about the challenges that some veterans—for example, those who are medically released, sometimes those who've had a longer time in service, even the ones with very short terms of service, things like that—face over others. There can be some barriers that don't exist, necessarily, for every veteran.

I wonder if you could speak a bit about those and about what services and supports are needed to help those veterans. What I'm talking about is that, before they even get to employment services, there are often other services, rehab services, etc. What's needed there? What are the gaps in what's provided now by Veterans Affairs, and what can be done better and differently to make sure we get veterans to a place where they can get to post-military service more quickly and more successfully?

I'm not sure who wants to start, but it's for either one of you if you'd like.

[Lisa Taylor]

It really touches on the intersectional nature of employment. Everybody comes at employment from different perspectives and has different capacities and challenges in order to be able to engage in their work.

The research is clear that there are groups that struggle more after release, but it also aligns with areas in the general Canadian population where we see challenges with employment and career transition. That's where general frameworks and strategies that recognize there are different groups that need to be treated differently should be a part of the strategy from the very beginning.

In terms of the service they receive, they need to start early and focus on how it's going to feel when they can no longer put their uniform on and introduce themselves with their rank and title. That focus on who they are is the very beginning part. That recognizes all the different pieces of their identity, including their family status, where they want to live, what part of the country they're in, and all those kinds of things, in addition to gender, number of years of service and medical status.