Veterans Affairs Committee on May 1st, 2023

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

That's wonderful.

Okay. My questions are yes or no questions, and if your answer is a “yes” and you could provide the committee the information that would validate your response, I would appreciate it. These are recommendations loosely over the course of the last seven and a half years.

In regard to non-medical and medical releases under this process, do you have specific points when you inform those who are enlisting, those who are serving and those who are eventually releasing or being medically released? Are there understood times in your process when that is done?

[Col Lisa Noonan]

Yes, that's in progress. We are developing training and education so that all members at every stage of their career will know about these.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

Okay. That's wonderful.

Then, for my next question, I see the process, and it involves both CAF and VAC. Who is accountable for what and when? Do you have a system set up to clearly indicate that “the ball stops here” as far as who's responsible for what the next steps are in the transition, yes or no?

[Col Lisa Noonan]

Yes.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

Okay. If you can provide that to us, that would be great.

Next, for this process eventually, it says that a VAC service agent is engaged before release “if required”. I'm just wondering, do you have a clear definition of what “if required” means?

[Col Lisa Noonan]

Yes. When the transition adviser talks to the individual, it may be clear they have some injuries they've sustained, so they might need to talk to VAC. However, even if they're not sure, they recommend that they go and see the VAC agent just to make sure they're aware of the benefits and can discuss it thoroughly with them.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

Okay, great.

I have a problem that I think every member who's come to testify here has had. It is, as my colleague stated, this: How do you medically release someone? Someone who doesn't want leave the forces is being told they can't stay there anymore because they have medical issues. However, there is, still to this day, this chasm between VAC and the CAF on who does what when. That will remain an ongoing problem for veterans until that is rectified.

If they are going to make a decision that they have to medically release, why is that decision not joint, guaranteed and signed off on by both the CAF and VAC before that individual faces that huge stress of knowing that the way it's worked thus far is that they get out and then they face all kinds of issues? They have sanctuary trauma. They have mental health issues, and a lot of it is related to this particular point of moving from service to being a veteran.

[Col Lisa Noonan]

Right.

I think that Colonel Wright probably would be better to respond to the question about the medical release process. Then I can speak to some of the other aspects that you mentioned.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

You have 30 seconds each.

[Col Helen Wright]

The medical release process has to do with meeting the bona fide occupational requirements of the CAF. Caring for our members is a separate process. We look after our members regardless of why they are ill or injured. It doesn't matter if it's service-related or not service-related. We are the care provider for these folks.

I think that maybe part of the difference here is that our goal is to look after our folks, not to worry about, at that stage while we're looking after them, what the benefit—

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

I'm sorry. Can I just interject there?

Do they feel they are being cared for, then, when they are being medically released but know that those medical conditions aren't necessarily going to be recognized? That's just a yes or no question.

[Col. Helen Wright]

I can't comment—

[Col Lisa Noonan]

I can add to that. If the individual is being medically released and their condition and medical limitations are such that they need extra support, they can be posted to a transition centre. In that particular circumstance, they are given a case manager and all kinds of extra support as they could, perhaps, then need extra services, extra programs, extra benefits, etc.

The posting of the individual to the transition centre gets them out of the unit. It allows them to have that one-on-one assistance and counselling that they require. It also helps ease—

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

But they are still employed and still receiving their salary?

[Col Lisa Noonan]

Yes. Yes, they receive all of their salary.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

Where does the process, here, of the transition then go into long-term care? We know that many veterans develop their needs over time. Is that a guarantee, as well? Is it a case manager, or is it with the new rehabilitation program? It's confusing.

What would the recommendation be, and who would they know would have their backs at VAC?

[Col Lisa Noonan]

While they are still serving, they can apply for long-term disability. We have SISIP; that's the first provider of vocational rehab. They can access that up to six months before they release and up to two years after release. At that point, VAC, depending on circumstances and the program, can take over if required. There is that hand-off to VAC of the individual and those conversations between our service provider, Manulife, and VAC.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

Can I ask, then, how—

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Mrs. Wagantall, I'm sorry. It's more than five minutes.

Those witnesses will stay with us. They are with us for two hours, so we have time to come back and ask questions.

Now I'd like to invite Mr. Wilson Miao for five minutes, please.

[Wilson Miao, Liberal, Richmond Centre, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, all of you, for joining us today. Most definitely thank you all for all your services.

First, through the chair, I would like to address the following question to Captain Beck.

As the director of mental health at the CAF, what you say would be the best procedure to support women veterans with their mental health challenges?

[Capt(N) Iain Beck]

As Colonel Wright alluded to, I think the key is to assess whether there are some vulnerabilities. Are there some unique factors and risks in our female population that we need to address well before they ever become veterans?

I think we need to certainly put that in writing. We need to do a thorough assessment and then move forward with implementation of a well-thought-out, deliberate plan. I don't think we have that quite yet. That's partly why we have developed this directorate of women's health and diversity that Colonel Wright leads.

[Wilson Miao, Liberal, Richmond Centre, BC]

That's understandable, because our study is on the experience of women veterans, and most of the time women veterans are being neglected or invisible, a term that came along during our study.

There's definitely more work to be done, but would you say that more understanding of our women veterans is needed, not just from a veteran level but from a CAF level?

[Capt(N) Iain Beck]

Certainly, I think that, to do anything properly, you always have to go to those affected. In our health services setting, I always want to hear from the medics, those frontline folks, the nurses, etc.

We also need to hear from our female members. What do they see as issues? Where do they see solutions? It's not just on us to dictate and push things down; I think it needs to start right at those affected. I think that's something we can do, and I think that's something that Colonel Wright and her team are looking at.

[Wilson Miao, Liberal, Richmond Centre, BC]

Thank you.

The following question is open to the floor.

What are the biggest issues that women veterans face during their transition back to civilian life?

Maybe, Captain Beck, you could start first.

[Capt(N) Iain Beck]

I think Colonel Noonan nailed it earlier when she said that it's about understanding where they fit into the system, that identity and that purpose. When I was at the transition group, we created some modules on that.

Part of being in the Canadian Armed Forces is being part of a community, a family and a shared purpose. I think it's probably like male members who are released. I think it's about, "What do I do now? Where do I fit in in life? What's my purpose?"

That's a mental health, a spiritual and physical health issue.

That's what I would say to start.