Veterans Affairs Committee on Dec. 7th, 2023

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Thank you.

That's unfortunate, because I think it's important for those who served in Afghanistan to have the opportunity to know what has happened with the interference that the PMO provided in their monument, but I guess that will wait until some time in February, I suppose, unfortunately, instead of now. It would have been nice to be able to deal with the motion quickly and come back to our witnesses, but we will just be going straight back to the witnesses. That's fine.

I will start with a question for Ms. Meunier.

You mentioned in your opening remarks that you have an annual forum. I can't remember exactly what you called it, but it was essentially to listen to the challenges that women veterans face.

I wonder if you could tell us a little bit about what was heard at this year's forum and what changes VAC will be undertaking as a result of what you heard from women at this year's forum.

[Amy Meunier]

The forum was held in February of this year. It was a hybrid event, both virtual and in person, with over 250 individuals participating.

Some of the key themes that we heard were that we need to strengthen the inclusive and intersectional GBA+ mindset within Veterans Affairs and CAF-DND, include marginalized and underserved voices with lived experience in the design, development and evaluation of programs, policies and services as well as commemorations, and continue to lead on concrete actions towards more equitable futures for all veterans.

We also heard a bit about the office of women and 2SLGBTQI+ veterans, for which I'm the ADM responsible presently, to have an expanded focus that's inclusive of all marginalized veterans groups, in particular recognizing the cultural needs of two-spirit veterans as well as first nation, Inuit, Métis, Black and racialized veterans when addressing the needs of marginalized veterans.

The panellists and other individuals there called for the department to diversify, enhance the ways we engage and include veterans in our program policy development, addressing gender biases and providing individually focused, trauma-informed research care and support for women and 2SLGBTQI+ veterans.

The forum in February was inclusive of both women and 2SLGBTQI+ veterans. We are actively working on the next upcoming forum, which we expect to take place in the new year.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

I have a question, as well, for Colonel Rowe.

It's probably for you. You can refer it, if you think that's necessary.

We've heard throughout this study from women who talk about the fact that much of their equipment or kit doesn't work for a woman's body, and about some of the injuries and challenges they face as a result of that. In particular, it's even to the point where we heard testimony about women having to alter their bodies, rather than having the kit or equipment altered to suit their bodies.

Can you speak about that and tell us what CAF is doing to ensure equipment or kit for women is appropriate for their use?

[Col Peter Rowe]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, for the question.

Unfortunately, I don't have much experience in that area, so I don't think I'm the right person to answer that.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Would you be able to have the appropriate person at DND provide us with a written response to that question?

[Col Peter Rowe]

I'm trying to think of who that might be. I'm not sure who is involved in developing the equipment for the Canadian Armed Forces.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Could you commit to going back and ensuring that happens? Otherwise, the committee would be required to have a motion to ask the department to provide that.

It looks like Ms. Rizzo Michelin has something to offer.

[Linda Rizzo Michelin]

I don't have an answer, but our parliamentary affairs staff are here. They can take care of that question for you.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Would you be willing to commit to bringing that back to the committee?

Thank you. We'll leave that one with you. That's much appreciated.

This is probably best placed with Ms. Meunier, but whoever feels it's appropriate to answer this....

There are a lot of common injuries we hear about in certain trades in the military. One very good example we hear about, often, is hearing loss and tinnitus. Can you give us a sense of whether you think a presumptive injury list or something along those lines would make sense, considering there are, no doubt, recurring conditions faced by many former members of the Canadian Armed Forces?

[Amy Meunier]

I might start off by highlighting that we—I talked about it in my introductory remarks—have entitlement eligibility guidelines. Those serve as a decision-making tool for individuals to link up trades, years of service, repetitive injuries—

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

I'm sorry to interrupt, but what I'm trying to get at is.... I appreciate and understand that exists, but we often hear about.... These types of claims are so common. Wouldn't it make sense not to put veterans through a long and exhaustive process to get something they're going to get in the end anyway?

Let's just presume it's an injury they received in their service and just provide it to them. That's what I'm getting at.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Go quickly, please, Ms. Meunier.

[Amy Meunier]

We're always looking at ways to improve the processes. Hearing loss and tinnitus would be decisions made quite quickly. I believe the current turnaround time is somewhere between four to six weeks.

We're always looking at ways to approach applications to render decisions much faster.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you very much.

Now I invite MP Randeep Sarai for six minutes.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

Thank you.

Thank you, all, for being here.

I have a quick mention for the clerk. Can he, in the future, make the names a bit larger or use a larger font? I'm 48 now, and my eyesight is not that great. I have to squint.

I believe it's Ms. Meunier, so I'll ask my question of her.

Thank you for being here today. We heard a lot from witnesses that programs and policies have to take into consideration the different needs of women veterans. Can you help explain what Veterans Affairs Canada is doing to take into account the different needs of women veterans in your programs and policies?

[Amy Meunier]

Thank you for that question.

I might ask some of my colleagues to join in the answer.

I would start off by saying that we are making sure we have a good understanding of the data and the actual experience of individuals. Our community health needs assessment will go a long way in helping us to refine our understanding of the unique and different challenges individuals may have throughout their life courses and, in particular, in helping them access benefits and services from the department.

With a GBA+ review and the GBA+ policy, we're systematically going through all our current policies to ensure that they have the right lens approach and that there are no unintentional biases or inadvertent obstacles built into them. As well, on the service delivery side, it's looking through all the operational tools. I mentioned the table of disabilities and the entitlement eligibility guidelines. It is looking at each one of those to ensure they represent the impact or the experience of gender diversity.

I think there are a lot of ways we are approaching how to improve our benefits and services, and the delivery of those benefits and services. In summary, I'd say it's about understanding the data and the actual experience, and about listening to the stories of lived experience from individuals such as those who have been part of this committee's study. It's making sure that we are building new programs and policies that take into account all diverse experiences and then operationalizing those, as well as looking at everything we have in place currently to make sure the programs are meeting the needs of a diverse population of veterans.

My colleague Pam may have more to add.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

Sure.

[Pamela Harrison, Senior Director, Engagement and Events, Department of Veterans Affairs]

Thank you for the question.

The testimony we've heard from more than 20 women, who have bravely come forward to this committee to share their stories, will go a long way in helping us to make changes, both within Veterans Affairs Canada and the Canadian Armed Forces. Their testimony was powerful. Being here today is an opportunity for us to thank not only this committee but also all those witnesses who came forward to share their powerful stories so that we can learn more.

We're also, on our part, collecting those stories. We're meeting with women veterans as often as we can to discuss the topics that are important to them. It's also to record their stories and to share their stories out. We've been told that storytelling is important so that they're connected to their community and they understand that they're not alone in what they've experienced in service and post-service life.

Thank you.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

Thank you.

Going on that, witnesses told us some challenges they faced in terms of their reproductive health. One example we heard was that it's hard to accept the fact that a physical or mental injury associated with one's service had an impact on one's reproductive health or childbirth.

What's your strategy to address these particular issues for the women facing them?

This is for Ms. Meunier or Ms. Harrison.

[Amy Meunier]

I might look to my colleague Dr. Cyd Courchesne.

[Dr. Cyd Courchesne, Chief Medical Officer, Department of Veterans Affairs]

Thank you.

Yes, we've heard those stories. This would come through to the department through an application for a disability. Each case would be evaluated on a case-by-case basis. If it was related to their service in any way, then we would look to support that veteran.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

Have you looked at these types of situations to see the correlation? Has there been any work done, any scientific evidence or asking medical doctors who might be able to help?

Traditionally, obviously, it probably wasn't something that was looked at. With the entry of women into the armed forces and with these types of injuries happening, I think it's something that should be taken into consideration. I don't know if there has been a strategy on that.

[Dr. Cyd Courchesne]

Thank you.

You're correct. There hasn't been much research done on that. As cases come forward, we don't have any data right now to trend, per se. We are working closely with our colleagues from the Canadian Armed Forces in doing research on reproductive health in women—serving members and veterans. We look to find out more in this area as we hear the stories come to us.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

In my last question, I made reference to a veteran who called me the other day with a question. The question was about the need for case managers in particular to receive training about trauma awareness.

What type of training does typical staff at VAC receive in terms of understanding trauma awareness?

[Dr. Cyd Courchesne]

I'll take that question, if my colleagues don't mind.

In 2020 we started providing all frontline staff with trauma-informed care. That's the core and the basis of training, but they receive more training on screening for suicidal risks and the road to mental readiness. They have a progression of training that is provided to the frontline staff and to all other staff in the department, in fact.